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Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => Scandinavian Glass => Topic started by: flying free on July 28, 2021, 05:26:02 PM
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I've bought a set of 4 bowls which are all signed on the base with individual design numbers.
They are, I think, part of a set of at least 8 due to the numbers on mine.
Can anyone help with any further information on these please? design numbers are Or L.1084 AL and then ranging up to 1090
I believe designed by Lindstrand and then engraved by Arne Lindahl and date to 1931. However the info I find says Arne Lindahl was working for Orrefors from 1938?
I think they might have been designed with the 1932 Olympics in mind given the engravings on them.
Many thanks for any help.
m
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M, as you know sorting out Orrefors codes are a challenge.
In the Swedish glass factories book the first time i can spot that design is in the 1935 catalogue (in time for the 1936 Olympics ?)
At the start of the numbers you posted Orrefors have Lx and then the number. (capital L and lower case x.)
There are 3 of your bowls illustrated.
Lx1086= running
Lx1088= weightlifting
Lx1091= football
In that range of numbers there are photos of what may be cylindrical cigarette holders?
These have sporting themes as well.
Lx
1082
1085
1093
1189
Hopefully that has been of some use.
Tim
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An absolutely massive help Tim. Thank you.
Are there any tiny cylindrical glasses without the engraved figures on? or are they all with the engraved figures.
It's a little confusing yes , but mine have no small x on them just signed ' of L.1088. AL (Al.?)' . I'm saying AL however... the L does not look like the Lindstrand L and on the others it actually looks like ' Al. ' Also they don't look as though the signature has been engraved by the same hand.
So I need to investigate other engravers other than Arne Lindahl. Possibly an Al (or AI but the I is just engraved as a straight line).
I think that answer my query over Arne Lindahl working there from 1938 so too late to have engraved the bowls I thought. But perhaps it might be that the 'signing person' signed 'Al.' with that straight line as an L?
I think the engraver initials are ' Al. ' . If indeed that refers to the engraver because
looking through this list there is no engraver with those initials although it could be an L I suppose for Lindahl but that would be too late for 1932 and 1936 Olympics :-\
https://web.archive.org/web/20200112233107/http://glassfromsweden.com/orrefors-engraved-glass-engravers-list.html
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oh ok,I've just found the info about the dating, it could be that is not engraver initials but is in fact 'A1.' written 'Al.' and that refers to the date of 1935 which matches your date for them appearing in the catalogue. Thank you Tim.
His work, ( along with Hald and Gate also) was part of the art competition in the 1932 and 1936 Olympics so that might make sense of the reason/theme for designing some soda glass bowls (a production design I mean, not that they were part of the art competition).
What was Orrefors Sandvik? Was this a separate place where the soda glass items were produced?
https://web.archive.org/web/20200112233832/http://glassfromsweden.com/how-to-date-orrefors.html
m
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I have what looks like a figure skater. Or L. 1085. A1 so they must have been for Winter Olympics as well.
I've checked through Fieldings and they have the shape of the bowl but with no engraving id'd as Simon Gate so I wonder if the bowl shape and black foot design dates earlier to the 1931 date I found in Miller's guide maybe but the ones with the engraved figures date to 1935 and were a Lindstrand design?
m
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In the 1932 catalogue your bowl in the unengraved version has an I/D, GU84 -H852.
In the 1933 catalogue your bowl with a figure skater engraved has an I/D H852.
What i thought were cigarette holders are glasses from a decanter set (unengraved) ID/ LUx 137/3.
As far as i know no Sandvik glass was signed.
I think Sandvik glass is very under rated. It was designed by the top Swedish designers of the day. (I have 4 items so far).
Good luck trying to pinpoint the engraver.
Tim
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Thank you Tim.
I'm not worried about the engraver now. I think the A1 is A1 which would date them to 1935 i.e. designed for the upcoming Olympics.
I think the bowl design maybe Hald then if those numbers are H for Hald? and my engraved version of the bowl is the 'development' of a previous design but this time by Lindstrand i.e. his design idea to add the Olympic designs on them?
I've read conflicting reports of whether Lindstrand engraved or not.
I've bought a little set of the glasses but I'm undecided as to whether they actually might be a Leerdam design rather than an Orrefors one. They are unengraved but have a cut ridged design around them. The shape and foot is very close to a Leerdam item though. Also 1930s.
m
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and thank you so much for your help btw. I really appreciate it :)
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That is how i was reading the sequence of events.
Any chance of a few photos?
I bet they are nice looking items.
Tim
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Ok, I'll post them in the next couple of days. Things are a bit non glass focused here at the moment, but in between searching for other things I just saw these and thought they were interesting. It's been a while since I've seen something a bit different.
Been concentrating on decorating and so obviously 'needed' to have a Malachite and bronze box (not glass but stone malachite) because it's the 'right' green. And then saw these little bowls. They wont go anywhere but they just caught my eye and I didn't remember seeing anything like them before. I may give my son the glasses as shot glasses though.
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Pic of skater bowl:)
They have never been used. The bases are immaculate with a large polished pontil mark right up to the edge.
The edges of each of the bowls are cut flat and polished.
These are tiny bowls and extremely delicate, light and fragile.
The engravings are stylised and are done in such a way as to give the perfect sense of movement of the sport- much like a cartoon might. For example the skater even has a cross drawn below the feet to indicate a movement on the ice.
They're just lovely.
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Thanks for posting your pictures M.
Very classy items, if i had seen them out and about i would have taken them home :)
Tim
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They are classy aren't they. That's the perfect word to describe them. The detail and the execution is perfect in every way.
I'm attaching pictures of the little liqueur glasses that came with them. They are a different design and I thought maybe Leerdam but on second look I'm sure they aren't and they aren't marked either.
They are very slightly reminiscent of this vase the thick foot, the turned out rim maybe?
https://assets.catawiki.nl/assets/2020/4/22/b/b/a/bbae1e48-7f29-416b-aa58-fa1f59f2562d.jpg
and this design although the base on this is removable:
https://www.botterweg.com/Copier_A_D/Leerdam/tabid/234/lotid/29964/Lot-29964.aspx?language=en-US
Again they are exquisitely made, very lightweight, the ridge design is cut and polished on both angles and immaculate. No marking on the bases.
Sorry, the base pic is a little fuzzy but it's the best I could get. The angle is sharp between side of foot and base despite what it looks like in the photograph, but the bases look molded or very smoothed off. Maybe Czech perhaps?
Just a long shot to see if they 'could' be Orrefors perhaps. Thank you for any input - it is much appreciated.
m
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What was Orrefors Sandvik? Was this a separate place where the soda glass items were produced?
m
Sandviks glasfbruk:
Situated in Hovmantorp, was founded in 1889, went bust in 1902. By 1903 it was bought by Edw Strömberg, who (reputedly) made mostly preserving jars until he sold it to Orrefors in 1917. (Himself went on to be highest boss in Orrefors proper.)
Since then Sandvik manufactured all the sophisticated soda glass that Orrefors sold (the "cheap" too, I dare say); they did so until the closure in 2005. ”All” ordinary orrefors designers also worked for Sandvik, for their soda glass.
Thus, the village Hovmantorp had two glassworks for a considarable time: Hofmantorp from 1859-1878 and then Hofmantorps nya glasbruk, which became just Hovmantorps glasbruk in 1905-1968.
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Thanks for taking the time to post so much detail Kerstin :) Much appreciated and very nice to learn a little more. I don't have many Scandinavian pieces at all - a handful, so it's not history I've delved into much.
m
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I'm wondering if these might be caviar bowls?
I came across this as you do, in a similar shape and they are described as caviar bowls (Baccarat) although that might just be the seller's interpretation of what they were for:
https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/set-baccarat-caviar-bowls-474905862
Any thoughts would be helpful.
Thank you.
m
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M, have just looked at Kerstins Orrefors catalogue price list for 1926 (which may be a little to early for your glass).
The Swedish spelling for caviar is kaviar, this does not show up in the price list name of goods.
Maybe Swedish life took of and caviar became more popular in the thirties.
Tim
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Thanks you for checking Tim :)
It was a long shot just because I spotted the similar shape in those Baccarat bowls.
m
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I'm wondering if the glasses are liqueur glasses and may have been designed by Rozendaal for Kristalunie Maastricht?
I came across a decanter set called Allround which has a similar type of foot and then discovered a liqueur set called Curro which seems to have similar shaped liqueur glasses:
https://www.christies.com/en/lot/lot-4117108
https://www.botterweg.com/Rozendaal_W_J/Kristalunie_Maastricht/tabid/59/lotid/27696/Kavel-27696.aspx?language=nl-NL
and also the lid on this appears to be similar:
https://www.catawiki.com/en/l/26432441-w-j-rozendaal-kristalunie-maastricht-art-deco-bowl-set-glass#&gid=1&pid=10
There are various examples of the Curro design on the net and the foot seems to vary.
Anyway just adding in case it helps in future searches :)
m
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Just been flicking through a Collectables Guide and noticed a King’s Lynn vase that has the same looking disk foot as your glasses.
The vase is designed by Ronald Stennett-Wilson. It is 5 inches tall, blue (very dark where it’s thick) and looks a bit like a brandy glass with a heavy foot and stubby stem. The ratio of diameter to thickness of the foot looks to be about 5:1, similar to your glasses. Maybe of interest.
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Thank you Ekimp :)
I've had a search but not been able to find that but will go through my books tomorrow and see if I can spot it or something similar.
m
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On your glasses again, just been looking in McConnell’s The Decanter 2nd edition and noticed an advertisement he shows (page 426) for Royal Brierley from the Pottery Gazette 1935. The image isn’t very big but there are some glasses shown that look very similar to yours. They look the same shape but with an inch or so off the top. They look to have a thick black disk foot and rings cut around the bowl, but with the bowl frosted. Annotated on the advertisement as No. 552A. Cocktail Set frosted, Crystal and Black.
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Came across this while browsing. Orrefors 1932 catalog, page 13 bottom middle shows a similar bowl with engraved figures (if you zoom in), possibly skaters. https://www.matslinder.no/2019/10/31/orrefors-produktkatalog-fra-1932/
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ooh thanks so much Ekimp! That's really good to see the original info.
I'm distracted by life and such at the mo but will get back to researching my glass a bit more soon I hope!
m