Glass Message Board

Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: joost on January 28, 2009, 08:35:45 PM

Title: Collecting glass measures
Post by: joost on January 28, 2009, 08:35:45 PM
Hello

I am a new visitor at this forum.
My wife and I are starting collectors of old and antique glass measures such as kitchen measures or apothecary measures.
We bought some at fairs recently and we wonder if someone knows some books or websites on these items.
We also saw etched in the glass a typical mark on some of the British measures. We were told by a dealer that this had to do with the age of the glass measure but he couldn't tell us more.
I there anyone who could help???? Forgive the bad use of the English language!!
Please see the attached files
Thank you very much  in advance!

Joost
(The Netherlands)
Title: Re: who could help?
Post by: Anne on January 28, 2009, 09:12:07 PM
Hello Joost and welcome to the board. :)  I'd not seen these small measures before then today I see your post after coming in from seeing one for sale in a charity shop near me. I can't add anything to your query but will be interested to know if anyone else can.
Title: Re: who could help?
Post by: Carolyn Preston on January 29, 2009, 12:41:41 AM
Off the top of my head, is there any chance that the etched mark indicates some kind of accreditation, i.e.) that one ounce is really one ounce, or whatever?

Welcome to the board Joost.

Carolyn
Title: Re: who could help?
Post by: Lustrousstone on January 29, 2009, 07:42:25 AM
Welcome to the board Joost

Probably Carolyn. The British Standards Institute was established in 1930. I can't help thinking the top one has a GR = George Rex under the crown. But what does it say above the crown?

Can we see the bases and the actual measurements scale please. A piece of black paper inside might help if it's not clear.
Title: Re: who could help?
Post by: Bernard C on January 29, 2009, 01:24:53 PM
Joost — The sandblasted (not etched) weights & measures mark shows that it has been checked by the authorities and can be used for retail and other legal purposes.

Translation:-
  • GR — George V and VI.
  • G2R — George V and VI, the 2 possibly a mark of the City of London.
  • 24 GRADS — 24 graduations tested (this stops more being added).
  • 14 GRD — 14 graduations tested.
  • 545 — Weights & Measures Office number for their York office (not the whole of Yorkshire as there were several offices in the three ridings).   Unfortunately this does not help with identifying a manufacturing glassworks.
  • Dagger in a Cross in a Shield — I've not seen this before.  The dagger represents London's Guildhall, which, with the cross of St George, becomes the arms of the City of London.   So the City of London (i.e. the square mile) Weights & Measures Office.   Again this does not help with identifying a manufacturing glassworks.

    • The same type of mark was used on all measures.   In December I saw a similar mark on the massive Avery weighbridge at Quainton Station, used for weighing railway trucks full of commodities like coal.

    Joost, that City of London measure is a real gem.    :hiclp: :hiclp:

    Bernard C.  8)
    Title: Re: who could help?
    Post by: Bernard C on January 30, 2009, 09:59:13 AM
    ... one further possibility ...

    The "2" in G2R could be an inspector number.

    Bernard C.  8)
    Title: Re: who could help?
    Post by: joost on January 30, 2009, 12:22:30 PM
    Thank you for all the answers and the offered help! Fantastic!
    The hobby is getting interesting more and more that way.
    Are there any suggestions for litterature?
    I will try to make a better picture.


    Many thanks!

    Joost
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Mike M on January 30, 2009, 02:46:27 PM
    Hi

    'Whisky Dispensers and Measures'  by Brian Brooks

    might be useful

    if you can't find it - email me directly for Brian's email address

    cheers

    Mike
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: joost on January 30, 2009, 04:44:06 PM
    hello Mike,

    I found the book at this website:  http://whiskywords.co.uk/booksa.aspx
    Is it really worth buying it? I don't know the precise contents so?

    Thank you for the advice

    Joost
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Bernard C on January 30, 2009, 05:12:41 PM
    Joost — Several more thoughts ...

    1. While the Weights & Measures Office location does not directly give you the manufacturing glassworks, you can make an informed guess.   Wood Brothers of Barnsley were world leaders in pharmacy and laboratory glassware, also, without question, our most successful glassworks at exporting to the difficult USA market.   I'm fairly certain that there wasn't a Weights & Measures Office in Barnsley, so York, covering the parts of Yorkshire that other Yorkshire Weights & Measures Offices didn't reach, was probably their office.   So, all in all, more than an evens chance that your 545 measure was made by Wood Brothers.

    2. As with all engraved glass, blanks may have been bought by an engraving operation, so your City of London measure could be City of London engraving on a blank from elsewhere.   So both of your measures could have been made by Wood Brothers of Barnsley!

    3. I'm a great believer in exposing young children to as wide a variety of number and logic experiences as possible, particularly today, when the best mathematicians don't become schoolteachers.   This includes measuring and calculating length, area and volume, number games like cribbage and dominoes, games of logic like draughts and Rubik's cube, and experience of as many number systems as possible, particularly bases 10, 2, 12 and 16.   A collection of relatively inexpensive measures in a variety of units could be a great asset in this.

    Bernard C.  8)
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Mike M on January 30, 2009, 06:33:37 PM
    Its good for  exactly what it says it is

    WHISKY - Dispensers and Meaures -a very specialist area -well covered

    its not about kitchenalia etc

    hope this helps

    Mike
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: joost on February 04, 2009, 06:39:35 PM
    Thank you all for the very interesting reactions to my question. They were indeed very helpful.
    Is there any form of liitterature, websites and so on that can help with dating glass and specifically measure glasses. Any suggestions will be very welcome.
    many thanks in advance
    Joost
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Frank on February 04, 2009, 07:19:08 PM
    Quote from: Mike M on January 30, 2009, 02:46:27 PM
    Hi

    'Whisky Dispensers and Measures'  by Brian Brooks

    might be useful

    if you can't find it - email me directly for Brian's email address

    cheers

    Mike

    Six pounds... amazing in this day and age.
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Anne on March 06, 2009, 12:28:09 AM
    Just picking this up again, the wee measure I saw wasn't there when I went back two weeks ago, but miraculously had reappeared today so it's come home with me this time.  It's 11cm tall (that's almost 4½" for imperial folks like me!) and is marked on the side in Fl.OZ (fluid ounces) and Fl. DR (fluid drams), whilst on the base is etch-stamped

    FOREIGN GLASS
    GRADUATED IN ENGLAND

    I'll add pictures asap for reference.

    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: joost on March 06, 2009, 08:43:27 AM
    Hello Anne,

    Thank you for picking up this message again.
    I'm anxious to see the pictures. Still very hard to find references for measuring glasses.

    regards!

    Joost
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Ivo on March 06, 2009, 09:20:19 AM
    Do you include kitchen measures in your collection - or just the apothecary and photographic ones?
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: joost on March 06, 2009, 10:22:00 AM
    We are trying to collect also the kitchen measures but we are starting our colelction and it's very hard to find some good information.
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: sph@ngw on March 09, 2009, 05:45:22 PM
    We  (Nazeing Glass Works), still manufacture glass measures for a company called AJ Cope  of 11-12 The Oval, hHackney road, London E2. We took over the business when a small glass manufacturing company in Barnet, I think, called Foleys stopped making them and their MD Brian? Foley became a director of Copes.He gave us all the moulds, but has now retired from Copes, and two brothers run the business.
    We make about 8 different sizes in two different shapes a "funnel "shape and a "cup" shape. I will try to get some piccies. Copes do all the measuring by engraving them, and then they have to have the Government Weights and Measures stamp of approval. This assures patients they are getting exactly 250 mls of medecine  ( or whatever),as dispensed by the chemist on your doctor's instructions.
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: joost on March 10, 2009, 03:54:15 PM
    Hello,
    Thank you very much for your reaction to this post.
    I'm very much interested in some more information about the companies you mention and off course in the different kinds of glass measures you make (and made in the past).
    I would be very pleased to hear from you at what manner I could obtain that information. Some pictures would be very nice to have.
    Thank you in advance

    kind regards,

    Joost
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: sph@ngw on March 10, 2009, 04:23:45 PM
    May I suggest you go to this link to see photos of the range?
    http://www.thelabwarehouse.com/external/commerce/1/productfiles/339.pdf
    Regards, SP-H
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: joost on March 10, 2009, 05:54:10 PM
    Thank you again for the reaction and sending the link.
    Very nice to see that the models of measuring glasses hardly have changed in all the years they were used.
    Do you happen to know from what year the company started producing that kind of glasses?
    If there is a way obtaining ancient pricelists and so on, it would be very marvellous but I think that will be very difficult.
    Your reply is certainly very helpfull! Anyway : Thanks a lot for it.
    kind regards,

    Joost
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Frank on March 11, 2009, 12:50:49 AM
    Joost,

    Keep yours eyes open for a Delius catalogue (Amsterdam glassworks), I have one which I will add to the Glass Study in the future.
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Lustrousstone on March 11, 2009, 12:19:06 PM
    Some of the catalogues on here http://www.glas-musterbuch.de/ have glass measures in them, mostly towards the end. It does, however, mean hours of looking!
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: joost on March 11, 2009, 05:50:47 PM
    Thank you for sending the link.
    It's a lot of work but certainly worth it and looking at all those beautiful glassworks makes time flies!
    Joost
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: joost on March 11, 2009, 05:52:17 PM
    and Frank....Thank you for the suggestion. I will certainly look at it
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Anne on September 05, 2009, 02:46:03 PM
    I finally managed to get some pics of the wee measure mentioned earlier in this topic....
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: joost on September 06, 2009, 12:10:13 PM
    Hello Anne,

    Nice to get a message on this topic again. Thank you for the beautiful pictures.
    In the meantime our collection grew steadily. Lack of information is still the big problem.
    I hope someone reads this and knows any litterature or sites that can provide any information on these measures. We shortly bought ANTIQUES OF THE PHARMACY by Leslie Matthews. The book hasn't arrived yet but ...who knows.
    Any suggestion is very wellcome.

    all the best!

    Joost

    In the attachment one of our latest acquisitions
    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Anne on September 06, 2009, 04:09:54 PM
    Hi Joost, that's a nice example!   :mrgreen:

    Did you see the large uranium green one I posted a while ago? It's migrated south now to live with a certain uranium glass collector who also inhabits this board, but we still don't know any more about it other than its big and it glows! http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,23597.0.html



    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: joost on September 09, 2009, 01:31:31 PM
    Hi Anne,

    Yes I noticed it.
    A pity there is so little information about this kind of glass......

    regards

    Joost

    Title: Re: Collecting glass measures
    Post by: Frank on November 08, 2010, 12:26:19 AM
    see also http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,37153.0.html