Glass Message Board
Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => British & Irish Glass => Topic started by: malcmat on February 07, 2020, 09:57:06 PM
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looking for the I/D of this bowl
2 1/4 inches tall x 6 1/2 inches dia at rim
Rough concave pontil mark.
many thanks
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Nice piece - I'd plump for Nazeing (the presence of the 'e' always irritates me - you don't find one in 'mating', 'taking' or 'making' … and they have long first vowels) ;)
The shape does occur in Geoff. Timberlake's book, and the base looks about right for Nazeing. Possibly a less than common shape too.
However, let's see what others think.
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Nazeing certainly looks possible
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Many thanks Paul S and Christine
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IF you sail up the river Lee from the south, you see a headland that sticks out like a nose. We owe the name to Saxon invaders from Saxony, who gave the German name to the promitary.
Do you also mis spell Walton on the Naze as on the Naz, Paul?
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Unfortunately, for those folk for whom English isn't a mother tongue, life is tricky to say the least ;)
It's nigh on impossible to generalize with the English language, and suspect it's the same with most tongues - but ...............….
in simple form, and for those words like …. make, take, hope, nose, bake, and haze, that do not possess suffixes such ….. ing, tion etc., then the possession of the final letter 'e' makes it necessary to pronounce the vowels 'a' and 'o' as long sounding vowels - and not as short vowels as in cat, mat, peg, top etc.
But the rules change for example, with words such as hoping' - which has the suffix 'ing', but lacks the 'e' but nonetheless must still be pronounced with a long vowel sound 'o' as we would if the 'ing' were not there. If you understand language construction, this is a logical point, since the word, and others of similar ilk, have only a single consonant 'p' - but if the word was spelt 'hopping' - with two peeeeeees, then the presence of the double p automatically tells us the first vowel must be pronounced as a short vowel (as in hopping up and down) - tapping, hitting etc.
Just to confuse us however, there are words such as Nazeing, where the presence of only a single middle consonant would normally tell us that pronunciation would be with a long vowel 'a' - and the letter 'e' would be superfluous - this is back to words like hoping, making, taking etc.
No 'e' is required for us to know that with a single middle consonant we must pronounce the vowel as a long sound.
The answer here is possibly that that Nazeing is not a naturally occurring word, and is contrived/made up, so I suppose you can use the spelling and pronunciation of your choice ;D
I have known instances of the word 'glueing' spelt with an 'e', but most people would probably not do this.
I've just flicked through Geoffrey C. Timberlake's book on the Nazeing Glassworks, but have failed to see an explanation as to why the Company name was spelt the way it was/is.
For Walton-on-the-Naze, spelling is thus and Naze is always with a long vowel - a rural township in north east Essex - on the coast. Is this the location of your R. Lee?? - and yes, suspect that Naze in this instance is, as you suggest, a promontory or nose (sticks out).
all really just a case of semantics - am sure you knew all this, and just wanted to see some spilled ink ;D ;)
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Paul,
If you dislike glueing ( the correct but less used variant and teh original word now replaced by teh American variant of gluing, then perhaps you spell "Theatre" , "theater".
How do you get on with Beauchamp, and Cholmondely" ( Beecham and Chumley)?
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I don't ;) ;D - have to say that my social circle doesn't include upper class people with those names - but I am often disappointed with how our friends over the pond have taken to omitting some letters and changing the spelling of standard English.
But, we must learn to be tolerant, and I have to admit that common sense does suggest that theater and color are the more obvious spellings for such words.
I suppose there's snobbishness in there somewhere, but when standards slip I get a feeling that to some extent the quality of life and the better things slip with them.
But, I suppose, live and let live - it's probably all Shakespeare's fault ;)
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Going back to the original query. I would put this piece as an 'Elwell era' piece and quite typical.
That is to say, not from pre-war, nor the post-war known catalogues; it would not fit into either category based on my extension of those catalogues by going from the known to the unknown, using known colours and shapes.
My feeling is that it belongs firmly to the Elwell 'find' that SP-H ended up buying from one of Elwell's grand-daughters after we put her in touch with him. The groups of glass that we saw there included not only the shape and colour, but showed many other colours and shapes that clearly did not match the previous production that was documented as being made at Nazeing.
The hypothesis is that these pieces, which varied within each 'size', had a different form of how the colour was laid in to both pre, and post war items, and have snapped off pontils conformed to Elwell's idea that each item should look hand made and antique. The characteristics of the glass certainly suggest this.
If you accept this idea, then it isn't too much of a stretch of the imagination to think that these were the pieces referred to by Geoff Timberlake as designed on the back of a cigarette packet. It is possible that the more likely scenario is that the designs Elwell wanted were drawn in chalk on the floor of the blowing shop. We will probably never know for sure since both would have been ephemeral.
These pieces are likely to have been made after the post-war catalogue pieces that used more saturated pastel colours. Although there is no accurate date, I would say use a general 1950's.
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I would concur with Nigel that it is far more likely that these pieces are Nazeing made not Strathern as the shapes and moulds are Nazeing- we take our spelling from the nearby village Paul, apparently the second longest high street in the UK!
Anway Nazeing sounds better than Nazing (Narsing, or Naz -ing) phonetically!
In a handmade factory it sometimes happens a batch of glass comes out a slightly different colours ( a slip up by the batch maker perhaps who forgets to add a small amount of a certain chemical/loses his place on the recipe sheet, etc), and that would explain this unusual colour. Sometimes a new colour was made in small batches and did not catch on, or was just a day's sample, never t be repeated.
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That's aMAZEING! (Sorry, I couldn't help myself) ;D Feel free to dewibble!
Carolyn
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Yes Caroline we have often been called the AMazeing Glass Works, either in error, or because of our lasting ability when most other UK small glass Works have closed!
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;D ;D ;D
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You've all just reminded me that Bernard Cavelot used to mark his Nazeing product labels "Amazing Nazeing".
Still miss him when we do glass fairs - as others probably miss his inputs on these boards :(
Nigel