Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Unresolved Glass Queries => Topic started by: orangeglass on March 16, 2014, 03:14:44 PM
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Hi,
I purchased this bowl because I liked it - the seller thought it was Monart and was a bit upset when I told him it wasn't!
It does have some Ysart type features, the best I've come up with so far is possibly Peter McDougall. Can anyone shed any light on this?
It has a similar base to something else someone listed - can't remember what now but no definite attribution was given to that piece either. I suspect it could be 80's but that's just a guess really!
It measures 18cm diameter across rim, 7cm high.
The base has a very neat ground out pontil so it is concave, and polished, some age wear to base but not excessive.
There is a similar-ish one (but more detailed) on Ysart glass / Perthshire paperweight page.
Many thanks - any info much appreciated,
Roberta
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I don't know enough about Peter's work to be able to tell, but he is still working, as far as I know, and he sells weights though the Caithness Visitor Centre in Crieff, and in the gift shop/cafe opposite that.
You might be able to contact him through them?
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Okay,
Thanks for that - I'll look into it when I get chance,
Roberta
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Is there much age-related wear?
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It reminds me of Gray-Stan, the whorls and the way the colour is laid on.
This is a good example of the similarities I see
http://www.woolleyandwallis.co.uk/Lot/?sale=PG220307&lot=22&id=31437
However, the pontil mark doesn't remind me of Gray-Stan and I don't know whether the glass is too thick for Gray-Stan.
Just thought I'd mention it.
m
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Hi,
There is a bit of age related wear, not too much though and I think it dates to around the 80's?
If you look on Ysart glass
http://www.ysartglass.com/Otherglass/Perthshire.htm
there is a greeny bowl that looks similar, that's the closest I've got to.
Thanks,
Roberta
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and the bowls in that group have the white in which looks as though it's done in a similar way to yours.
It's probably best if you contact P McD and ask then.
m
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Thanks. I have sent an email to the visitor centre to see if I can make contact that way - will let you know if I get an answer!
Roberta
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Hi all,
I've managed to get in contact with Peter McDougall, he says it's not his bowl :(
So back to the drawing board - any ideas anyone?
Is it worth looking into Chic Young, Herbert Dreier?
Many thanks,
roberta
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Can you do a better, closer more enlarged picture from the top showing the whorls more clearly please?
Might work better on a black background for that although the colour will probably bleach out.
Thanks
m
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Could be one of those never identified.
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Hi,
Is it possible to change the title to "Not Peter Mcdougall" maybe Chic Young?
Re: photo's - for some reason the whorls don't seem to come out well on camera - I will try with a darker background to see if that helps.
does anyone else think this bowl looks like it comes from the same stable?
http://www.the-saleroom.com/en-gb/auction-catalogues/locke-and-england/catalogue-id-2894636/lot-21546540?searchitem=true
Many thanks, Roberta
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That says "Strathearn" very loudly to me. I may be wrong. ;)
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Look outside Scotland
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Would Nazeing be a silly answer?
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Hi all,
Not Strathearn , not Nazeing.
Frank - that's a bit cryptic - there's a whole world outside Scotland!
Thanks,
Roberta
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Nigel might know more and this stuff has been discussed before. Cannot recall any conclusions but Scottish not likely.
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If you do a close up large picture of the cloudy bit does it have very tiny little bubbles in it?
And does it weight a lot? is it very heavy for size?
m
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If we are talking about the aqua bowl in the auction lot, I don't think its Grey-Stan... is it?
You are being very cryptic, Frank. :P ;)
I'm staying out of this - I really don't have a clue about this area. :-[
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Sue did you mean the comment I made earlier in the thread about a bit of it reminding me of Gray-Stan?
Just in case you did, I was referring to this red vase here (see link) rather than the aqua bowl in the Sale room link that Roberta put on :)
http://www.woolleyandwallis.co.uk/Lot/?sale=PG220307&lot=22&id=31437
the cloudiness reminds me of the background white cloudy bit on this.
Edited to add
The reason I was asking for more pictures is because it also vaguely reminds me of the cloudy white bit on my Stevens and Williams pink streaky cloudy vase - but only that bit. Mine doesn't have the whorls and is cased with a heavy casing which this bowl doesn't seem to have. Also I don't know if the bowl is a Stevens and Williams shape. But still, it was just an observation really.
m
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No, m.
I was just suggesting another non-Scottish maker of this style of glass, and I was referring to the aqua bowl in the auction link Frank said wasn't Scottish - I think...
Your comment was on the previous page, and out of sight was out of mind. Sorry for repeating it. :-[
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:) oh sorry - just thought I'd check just in case. Ignore me ;D
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No, :-* it's ME that needs ignored. I will just read quietly from now on.
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Gray-Stan did do some stuff with quite defined whorls
http://www.the-saleroom.com/en-gb/auction-catalogues/woolley-and-wallis/catalogue-id-2892706/lot-21141214
But the pontil mark still doesn't look right for Gray-Stan. However I don't know if they ever did polished pontil marks. The pieces I have, and have had, haven't been polished.
m
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Hi all,
Here are some more pictures - I'm pretty certain Gray Stan it isn't - much as I'd love it to be! I need to have a look for whatever it was that someone else put on that reminded me of this - same base if I remember rightly (unfortunately that is the only thing I remember!!)
Do you think Frank knows something and isn't telling??
Peter McDougalls reply was - to quote "I would say it looks very much like a Vasart but I can not be sure, but it is off a Vasart design."
To me it looks like it someone who has worked with someone at Vasart / Strathearn - why does Frank say look outside Scotland?
Why do we drive ourselves potty about all this??
Anyway, the glass is full of tiny bubbles, and not any heavier than you'd expect. To me it looks like the glass is blue not clear, then swirled with (mainly) white and blue.
Frank, you aren't implying these could have been made in London are you?
Anyway, we may or may not ever know :P
Roberta
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ok thanks :)
I'm all out of thoughts then.
And I'm no expert on any of these ... I just like them - so for what it's worth my thoughts are:
There are pluses for Stevens and Williams, the cloudy technique looks similar to the white in my vase (but yours is all over, whereas mine is in streaks), the tiny bubbles look similar to those in my vase, the shape may be a possible, the pontil mark also. The minuses are I'm not sure the base is right, I don't know about S& W doing any whorls and it might not be thick or heavy enough for an S&W/RB piece.
To me it also has some similarities with Gray-STan in the way the white (white and blue) cloudiness seems to be done. But I don't know about the pontil mark or base, ... or shape or design for that matter :-[
There's always the Elwell pieces as well ... I don't know how it might fit in with that.
As I said, just my thoughts. Probably something else entirely ;D
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Nigel might add something. I know these have been discussed before over a long period but no time to hunt for the threads, sorry.
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Hi,
Thanks for that Frank, I've had a trawl through and read most (I think) of the related threads - no conclusions were reached, I'm not sure if my bowl is part of those things or not! Some of the items discussed seem to be dating back further than I think my bowl is, but who knows!! ???
Roberta
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Seen them since the 80s, and they were not new then. So not new kids on the block.
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see also http://ysartglass.com/Otherglass/Nazeing/NazeingG05.htm
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Hi,
I've looked at the Nazeing / Elwell stuff and I have a few bits of it - my bowl is nothing like them. Glass / colour / everything!
With regards to the other stuff I meant the other un-ID stuff does seem to be older than my bowl - someone -was it Nigel? said they had been around for quite a while and might even be contemporary with the Ysart stuff, i just don't think my bowl is that old - maybe 80's but just guessing.
Maybe more will turn up - I'm still waiting for Gary Millerart to have a look to see if he has any opinions!
Roberta