Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: Jeffingtons on September 16, 2017, 11:03:16 PM
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Classic charity shop find. Dusty pair on the bottom shelf. Decades out of my mid-century comfort zone but super quality and only £3. Faceted stem and fine engraving (thistles, roses and , shamrocks) makes me think they're early 19th century celebrating the act of union.
As I said, this is out of my usual area of expertise, so I'd appreciate the opinions of the glassmessages knowledgecloud. I can't shrink pics on my phone so I can only link to images right now.
https://flic.kr/p/XviNv1
https://flic.kr/p/Yb9ysS
https://flic.kr/p/YyHvJZ
https://flic.kr/p/Yb9DrQ
https://flic.kr/p/Yb9TmU
https://flic.kr/p/YuukfC
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Act of Union was 1707 and these look mid/late 19th Century, the flat foot and bowl shape are indicators of this but to be honest they could be later. How is the foot finished? It's hard to tell from the pics provided
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Act of union between England and Scotland was 1707. Act of union between England, Scotland and Ireland was 1801, which would tie up the pattern with an event. My only glass book which mentions faceted stems says they were used 1760-1800 which puts the 1801 union date right on the arse end of this period. From the research I've done, I'm unsure about the bowl shape too, and the relative slenderness of the stem. But there's transition periods I guess. I don't have enough info on the post 1800 period to know. Anyway, here's a bunch more pics taken in daylight
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/829cZg
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/5V3zGe
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/EPAQ2V
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/s34WJ4
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/61z9PL
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/02t819
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/8670kG
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/538d29
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/9062i8
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/520090
https://www.flickr.com/gp/jeffstuka/650B72
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I can't see if there is a broken pontil mark or not on the foot pictured but usually facet stems (c.1760-90's) have polished concave marks to keep them stable. I'd still say mid to late 19th century/20th century due to bowl shape and foot. Also if they were true Georgian facet cut stem wine glasses the bowls would be smaller
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The pontil mark is there. Having done a bit more digging, mid to late 19th century looks a good shout.
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A thought just occurred to me, 1851 and 1901 were anniversaries of the union with Ireland. Perhaps it's related to one of those. Or maybe the union idea is a red herring altogether.
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If there is a broken pontil mark then I'd opt for an earlier date around the first to second quarter of 19th century due to the quality of glasses - by mid 19th century all glasses of quality would be finished better (ie no broken pontil mark)
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They look like Edwardian sherry or cocktail glasses, the rough pontil is still used today it's no indicator of age and some Georgian glasses have neither a rough or polished pontil it depends on where and how they were made.
Some modern French glasses still have the multi cut narrow stem .
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Yes a broken pontil mark is no indicator of age in the collecting field of glass but with glasses of quality like these seem to be and the subject - a shamrock, rose and thistle we can safely assume that they are British glasses. So let me reiterate my point that no BRITISH wine / sherry/ glass would have a broken pontil mark post 1840-50 (of course there is exceptions like if they were made recently and I'm assuming that there is wear to indicate an earlier age which the op has failed to mention or the metal of said glass)
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Lead crystal. Some wear but not excessive. I've looked at a lot of glasses in books and online and think late Victorian or Edwardian is probably right, based on the bowl shape and foot. I'm looking forward to the weekend when I get to fill them with wine! :-)
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A large amount of British studio glass wine glasses have rough pontils, right from the 20's to modern day.