Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass Paperweights => Topic started by: Catisfaction on February 08, 2008, 12:14:30 AM
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I folks, sorry I haven't popped in to visit for a while, life has been getting in the way of my chatting time :cry: but I'm getting back into the swing of things so hopefully I'll be able to pop in from time to time again and at least look see if there's anything I can help with.
Meantime.... this one has been driving me nuts for about 3 months now give or take, It's signed... should be easy right? Nuuuuuuuuu lol I've googled my heart out on many occasions using *'s and ?'s to try and come up with a name to match the siggie, I've searched for pulled feather millefiori cane paperweights and I think the only ones I've come up with are Orient and Flume. I've even made my boyfriend try and figure it out for me! lol but to no avail.
So.... can anyone here give me a helping hand?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/th_14thNov07010.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/14thNov07010.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/th_14thNov07006.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/14thNov07006.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/th_14thNov07004.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/14thNov07004.jpg)
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Is that Schneider? It's hard to see exactly what that signature is. We did had a verrrry long discussion about Schneider once, referring to paperweights.
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That says Schneider - there have been a few discussions about Schneider paperweights here in the past.
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oho Max and me obviously get up at the same time!
this is the longest topic I can find on Schneider signed weights:
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,5502.0.html
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Thankyou all!! I had contemplated it starting with an S and dismissed it so many times.
Wow, I read that thread and there's so much info there yet so little :-\ I can't tell who's supposed to have done what and who didn't.
Well off to try and research some more. At least I have a name now! Thanks again.
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Yes you do but almost certainly a fake signature. Read through the other link and there is an example of the genuine 'Son of Schneider bros.) signature, yours is again a copy of the earlier Schneider signature and badly done by the looks of it :o
Yours is acid etched and that requires some sophistication! Despite their ignorance of the type of weight he produced.
direct link to sig post http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,5502.msg54958.html#msg54958
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Thanks Frank that clarifies a little, I was having trouble figuring out if this was supposed to be real or fake.
What are the chances it's a Murano piece with a fake siggie?
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Fake or not, that centre cane is very nice. A very nice quality piece.
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Yup yup, that's why it was driving me nuts not being able to figure out the siggie lol I was thinking a producer of such a gorgeous piece would be fairly easy to track down.
I guess for now it goes into the realms of the unknowns until I have more time to pick up the research thread again *sigh*
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Hey Cat :) The 'unknowns' are the ones you should enjoy! Well, for me anyway, having a piece of glass that is unknown is exciting! It's the thrill of the chase, and that makes it just so much more interesting. :)
Much better to have a piece of glass that gets people scratching their beards (well, the men anyway ^-^) than something that is 10 a penny. :D
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It is clear that someone has gone to the expense of making a rubber stamp for marking glass with the Schneider brothers signature and has access or made a suitable mixture for stamping. The last is not easy and would point to someone with glass industry experience. All of the weights that have shown up are clearly not Charles Jr. work unfortunately a lot of images on the other thread are missing. There are also fake Baccarat signatures circulating. Faking acid etched signatures is not that common, identifying where the weights were bought and who made them originally would be clearly useful.
Perhaps the two threads can be merged.
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Are the fake Baccarat marks only showing up on paperweights so far or on other items too?
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Here is a link to an article about Schneider glass, it also shows a Schneider signature
http://glassandpotterysellers.org/newsletter/31_jan2006.htm
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The signature on the weight compares quite well, but has some clear differences, with one of the many real versions used from 1918 to 1939 as shown in Edith Mannoni's book, Schneider.
Certainly, the form of the weight, which I suppose could be called a "double-ended Marbrie" (??) does not match with what is known of the Glass Globes produced post-war by the Schneider brothers, and pre-war Schneider did not make paperweights. So the conclusion on that evidence alone is that the signature on this item has to be false.
I agree that the weight is well made. I actually acted as servitor (with extremely little prior experience!!) in a fairly recent demonstration of making a Marbrie weight. It was surprising how many separate processes were required and how hard it can be to maintain an even flow of the pull-ups and also get everything centralised in readiness for capping with a cane. The fact that the weight shown here has a separate Marbrie-type pull at both the upper and lower sections (and there are opposing-direction pulls, too!) indicates it was made by somebody with a lot of experience of the work required. Sadly, the upper pulls don't all quite make it to the top of the weight, so it does show a degree of "lesser" expertise.
Personally, I do not think the maker of this weight would have been involved in a false signature, if only because of the idea that somebody with the necessary skill to make the weight would quite likely know that such items were not products of Schneider. I reckon it comes down, as is so often the case, to a dodgy dealer or export / import network having the signature added later.
That it has two distinct Marbrie loop sections (or perhaps Marbrie top with pull-up lower body) should, in theory, make it easier to narrow down the maker. But I have no idea who that may have been!
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I had not meant to imply that it was the weight maker that added the signature. But rubber stamping with acid is not easy to do and would need some experienced. I know someone that tried, they got tips from glassmakers, had rubber stamps made, experimented for several months to discover the right mixture to use - and failed. All the glass used for the experiments had the damage polished off.
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Thankyou so much for that educational info Kev, I'm assuming the Marbrie is the pulled feather design? I've not heard that word before.
I'm still looking into this, i'm sure it will be residing on my UGO shelf for a while but at least it's beautiful :)
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Marbrie (in paperweight speak) refers to "trailed loops" (like, but usually neater than, loops on "Nailsea" wares) rather than "pointed" (or "zigzag") pulls which is what most "feathered" pulls are.
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Images Moved
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(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/To%20List/th_14thNov07006.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/To%20List/?action=view¤t=14thNov07006.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/To%20List/th_14thNov07010.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/To%20List/?action=view¤t=14thNov07010.jpg)