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Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Unresolved Glass Queries => Topic started by: kieran on November 14, 2008, 11:43:54 AM

Title: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: kieran on November 14, 2008, 11:43:54 AM
Hi, this looks like whitefriars but not sure, usual clear polished pontil with surrounding  ripple effect, thanks Kieran
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: Leni on November 14, 2008, 12:56:25 PM
Size would be useful, Kieran! 

And you could always look at the Whitefriars catalogues which are available online.  It's sometimes a long job searching through them all, but you can learn a lot!  http://www.whitefriars.com/catalogues/index.php

Like, not everything with bubbles and / or a polished out pontil mark is Whitefriars!  ;)  Actually Webb did something very much like this, and they are often confused for WF.  Also, it could just be the photo, but your vase looks a little bit pale for a WF Amber / Golden Amber / Gold.   
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: johnphilip on November 14, 2008, 10:27:25 PM
The colour and the size of the pontil look wrong for W/Fs ,i would think Webb.
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: vidrioguapo on November 15, 2008, 08:35:46 AM
I tend to agree with you John, or it could also be Royal Brierley..........I have never been able to find this shape in any Whitefriars catalogue for the period in which this type of glass was made, and I've seen one in the flesh and the colour is definitely not  quite "right" for W/F.  Emmi
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: Bernard C on November 15, 2008, 09:36:49 AM
I'm getting hints of the appalling eBayworld habit of attributing anything unrecognised, unmarked, and handmade to Webb or Stevens & Williams.   Please tell me I'm wrong.   I hope I am.

Bernard C.  8)
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: Leni on November 15, 2008, 11:13:26 AM
 Please tell me I'm wrong.   I hope I am.

Bernard C.  8)
You're wrong, Bernard!  ;) :D Everything with bubbles and / or a polished out pontil mark is WF!  Everyone on ebay KNOWS that!  ::)

Seriously though, it is "well known" amongst WF aficionados that a vase like this, or a very similar design, was also made by Webb and that these vases are frequently confused.  As I said in my first post  ;)   
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: Ivo on November 15, 2008, 12:17:32 PM
I think it is a bit harsh to limit the options to just two. I could think of half a dozen possible makers!
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: Leni on November 15, 2008, 05:35:52 PM
I could think of half a dozen possible makers!
Perhaps you might be generous enough to share your thoughts with the rest of us then. 
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: johnphilip on November 15, 2008, 07:51:13 PM
All i am saying is the pontil looks a bit big for the size of the foot for it to be W/Fs . And yes it could be by several other glass houses . colours can depend on the photography . >:D :sleep:
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: Patrick on November 15, 2008, 08:31:07 PM
I could think of half a dozen possible makers!
Perhaps you might be generous enough to share your thoughts with the rest of us then. 

Hi Ivo,
It looks like the GAUNTLET has been thrown down then ( I have just been watching 'Merlin' on BBC 1 )

We currently have Webb,Royal Brierley and Stevens and Williams.......................
How about the other 3 ???????

Regards, Patrick ;)
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: Lustrousstone on November 15, 2008, 09:09:05 PM
Did Walsh do such controlled bubbly stuff? The pontil mark looks over-large like their often do.
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: aa on November 15, 2008, 09:16:20 PM
I have a feeling that Ivo is probably thinking about non-English glass companies. Shock horror! The idea that foreigners could have made stuff like this. ROTFL (listening to Robin Williams on We are most Amused) Scandinavia.....Germany....Italy.  ;)
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: Bernard C on November 15, 2008, 09:23:20 PM
Quote from: Lustrousstone
Did Walsh do such controlled bubbly stuff?   ...

Christine — Not that I'm aware of, but then, as we probably only know about a fraction of their production, anything is possible.

Bernard C.  8)
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: Ivo on November 15, 2008, 09:34:51 PM
I could think of half a dozen possible makers!
Perhaps you might be generous enough to share your thoughts with the rest of us then. 

Hi Ivo,
It looks like the GAUNTLET has been thrown down then ( I have just been watching 'Merlin' on BBC 1 )

We currently have Webb,Royal Brierley and Stevens and Williams.......................
How about the other 3 ???????

Regards, Patrick ;)

I'm not listing those in order to avoid lengthy discussions. But Adam is right. Every European country had its own manufacturers who produced what was fashionable at the time. Many WF products are undistinguishable from similar products made elsewhere. Every year, on the trade fair, the commercial people of all these factories would walk around with their sketch books and note the trend for the following year. Whether it be nail moulds, red Selenium, cubes and spheres, ice cube surfaces, frosting or prunts - the trend was set by few and followed by many. Often the trend was set by Scandinavian factories; but it could equally be Empoli or Leerdam or WMF who was copied.  And therefore it is quite easy to make a list of factories who worked in the same style, used the same colours and shapes and are likely to have produced a close lookalike.

Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: krsilber on November 16, 2008, 06:27:46 AM
What if we promise not to discuss it - then will you tell us? ;D
Title: Re: whitefriars ? id required
Post by: nigel benson on November 20, 2008, 10:58:24 PM
Quote
We currently have Webb,Royal Brierley and Stevens and Williams.......................


Patrick, would you count Whitefriars and Powell as two companies? If so then you're correct in counting this as 3 :o

Quote
it is "well known" amongst WF aficionados that a vase like this, or a very similar design, was also made by Webb

.....and outside W/f's circles too Leni ;)

Quote
I'm getting hints of the appalling eBayworld habit of attributing anything unrecognised, unmarked, and handmade to Webb or Stevens & Williams.

Bernard, firstly this is because many of the techniques and patterns used by Powell/Whitefriars were made by those two companies - for reasons well outlined by Ivo. Secondly, isn't it good that those folks are at least trying to think outside the very limited 'Whitefriars' box?

Finally, my vote goes for Stevens & Williams........or............Webb ::)

Nigel