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Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => USA => Topic started by: RAY on October 04, 2005, 05:42:45 PM

Title: whitefriars expert needed ID: Pairpoint swan?
Post by: RAY on October 04, 2005, 05:42:45 PM

i have purchased what i think is a rare whitefriars opal glass swan, it measures just under 8.5" high, i think it was Patrick Hogan that said he saw in Frank hill's work note's in the Museum of London that he made two opal glass swan's in 1945.

click on image for larger photo

Photos gone, but Ray's swan is still on Whitefriars.com (http://www.whitefriars.com/isit_contents.php?ID=2791).

Title: Post subject
Post by: vidrioguapo on October 05, 2005, 09:01:34 AM

Hi Ray, I am not an expert, but believe that is is not a Whitefriars swan.  Although it's a very similar shape, the graceful lines of the head and neck are almost identical, but Whitefriars swans have much more detail i.e. there is a a "bump" above the beak and the wings are more defined by a wave like shape going towards the tail.  On your example there is no definition in this area.  It is a very elegant piece though, but afraid I cannot put a makers name to it as swans are generally not my thing.  I am sure you'll get other opinions which may help.

Title: whitefriars expert needed
Post by: Max on October 05, 2005, 03:14:27 PM

I'd agree with Emmi Ray.  Your swan isn't quite right.   :(

The head is the most similar part to a WF swan, but the body looks wrong to me.  The base looks a little wide, and it's too defined in the 'well' - too hollow.  My WF swan has a marked hump internally, and it's 'well' is fairly shallow.

The definition along the body aren't right either to my mind.  Of course, I suppose it this swan was made by a different glassblower, it might have adopted a slightly different style, but you'd have to ask someone who's seen the opal ones.   :?

Title: whitefriars expert needed
Post by: Patrick Hogan on October 06, 2005, 11:40:58 AM

Hi, It was Vidfletch that first identified these Swans as Pairpoint ( an American company)........  It was the center of much discussion on the forum about 2 years ago.....  
 Frank Hill made probably the most eligant of all swans. I am not sure when they were first introduced but they first appeared in the 1938 catalogue.
The two Opal ones that I saw in his workbook were probably a special request by a retailer.   Regards Patrick

Title: whitefriars expert needed
Post by: paradisetrader on October 07, 2005, 10:21:11 PM

Ray
I believe these Swans are made from clambroth glass. Some items of this strange color are quite scarce sought after by collectors, no matter who made the item.

Title: whitefriars expert needed
Post by: glasswizard on October 07, 2005, 10:32:35 PM

I agree with Peter in that it looks like clambroth to me. Clambroth actually refers to the color and for those who don't like seafood and have never opened a can of clams and seen the milky broth a better way to describe it would be akin to skim milk. I have seen pressed items in clambroth but never anything done by hand as the swan appears to be. Terry