Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: Paul S. on July 12, 2010, 08:16:36 PM
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possibly another dead end - but couldn't resist its antique charm. Quite typical of the mid to late C19 inexpensive bottle green type glass, from which hordes of vases, bulb vases etc. were made - inclusion of bubbles (some elongated - was this rim spun out, or just slumped out?), seeds, and bit of undiluted colour. Why the almost imitation concave pontil? Plenty of wear, and I'm guessing something like 1880 - 1900, or perhaps a tad earlier. Multi-way, shallow, rounded crimp rim - diameter about 12 inches x 4.5 inches tall (305mm x 115mm). Lovely optic moulding. The very bottom of the inside is slightly humped, and recesses slightly into the outer part of the base, which has a plain coglike moulding (not a lot unlike a wfrs. style). Seen plenty of small pieces in this cheap colourway, but nothing this size or appeal before. If anyone has any ideas of origin or provenance, pleae do share with me, and thanks for looking.
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Hi Paul :)
This bowl is really interesting... I wonder why, if the quality of glass (in your opinion) leaves much to be desired, so much work was put into the crimp rim and optic moulding? :-\ I think it's a great bowl, and very pretty indeed. I hope someone will be able to help ID it for you.
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thanks Anik - appreciate your reply. Oddly, this piece is almost a contradiction of terms. The glass is of poor quality, and yet as you say the design, shape and optic moulding have great appeal. I've not seen one quite like it before, so I'm hoping an expert can shed a little light on it's history perhaps. I have no real idea if it is British or continental.
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I found these similar bowls on ebay UK -- http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Stunning-Green-Glass-Decorative-Bowl-/400128723236?cmd=ViewItem&hash=item5d2987c924 and http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Carnival-Glass-Fruit-Bowl-Green-Tint-Hankercheif-shape-/110556566296?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Art_Glass&hash=item19bdaf5318
One is listed as carnival glass, the other is listed as being 1950s/1960s/1970s (highly doublful in my opinion). It seems that these sellers also have no clue as to the origin or era... Shame since I find the bowl really interesting (as you called it, a contradiction) and am curious. Did you find any more information on it?
All the best :)
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sorry, not ignoring you......just that I was out glass hunting today ....have a lot of domestic jobs to do - up at 5 in the morning for the usual b.s., then lunch time with my sons in London at the British Library and British Museum - streuth doesn't it sound academic..........actually, I only go with them because they both have more ackers than me, and they pay for all the food and drink ;D
Promise I will get back to this soon as I can.........and incidentally, my sincere thanks for your interest in this bowl. Yours through thick and thin, and anything else......Paul S. ;)
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o.k. up and running again. thanks for the ebay links to similar items, and like you I think the date attribution for the green bowl is wildly out. I am no expert but have seen shed loads of this low quality bottle green glass - and would put money on the date being late C19 - early C20. The degree and amount of wear, speaks volumes, and no way is it mid or later C20. Re the clear looking bowl - and this appears to have a different style of crimping, but in some ways is also similar - where does the Carnival provenance come from?? I have never purchased from ebay, so have no experience to relate, but am surprised by the wildy inaccurate descriptions, by vendors who obviously have little knowledge of what they are selling. It goes without saying that sellers avoid discussing even legitimate wear on the base or inside - which is a pity, because these matters can say a great deal about a piece, especially genuinely older glass, and should be included in the descriptions. However, I do now think my bowl is possibly more common than I had first thought, so during the next 'spring clean' it may have to leave home. thanks again for your interest. :) p.s. presumably iron oxide was added to heighten the already greenish tinge which comes with poor quality silica?
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Paul,
This is from an English company, from the mid 20thcentury! They specialised in pressed glass. Since it is the subject of an article that I have produced and offered to the Glass Association I will leave it at that :huh: At least you have somewhere to look.......... ;D ;D
Nigel
PS. Note what appears to be the lines from a three part mould on the photo of the base. N.
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Nigel, you're just a big tease!! :thud:
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no wonder I'm paranoid - too late at night, especially after the Scotch - I will come back to this tomorrow :usd: :ooh: :huh:
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Nigel, you're just a big tease!!
Now that's a first :sun: Thank you kind lady ;) :)
Nigel
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Forgive me for playing a guessing game, but I can't resist... :pb: (Blame it on Mr. Benson...)
Could the bowl be Davidson? I read that Davidson re-introduced 'antique green' glass in 1964 and that the company used old moulds to introduce new shapes.
:huh:
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Now isn't that NIGEL just the cleverest kid on the block!! :hi:
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Looks like we'll all have to wait for the article to be published...
.... drums fingers on desk .... hums ..... checks date .... reloads topic .... hums .... drums fingers on desk ....
:chky:
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when Max said.....Nigel, you're just a big tease... I took that literally. You see, I am really just a simple country lad, and thought Nigel was joking (shakes locks of slightly curly blond hair, with a youthfull boyish charm and innocence :usd:) - so o.k. I b*****d it up. Like Anne, I have zero patience, and I want everything yesterday - so how long do we have to wait? ALSO...... to quote Nigel ....PS. Note what appears to be the lines from a three part mould on the photo of the base. N........who's vision is obviously 20/20 - I must be candid and say that until this evening I had not seen the 'Mercedes' logo on the faux pontil depression (in fact the base has a variety of weird circular marks). Last evening I thought that Nigel was imagining 'mould lines' - as there are no typical mould seams on this bowl. But I'm big enought to admit I was wrong >:( :usd: :pb: aghhh. The piece must be spun to produce the elongated bubbles out towards the crimped rim - and not just slumped like a handkerchief vase. But what threw me most of all is the evident wear - which really is substantial,inside and out, and equates to other pieces that I know to be much older. Some tyke must have taken a sheet of 120 grit to the bowl, is nothing sacred :cry: - and I think this is the first time I have come unstuck by relying on wear to help me date a piece. The colour and quality both lead you astray and make you think it is old. Anyway, Nigel is of course very clever, as we know......so three cheers for Nigel.... now where is article. :-[
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Blimey Nigel, hurry up and put us all out of our misery! :X: :hiclp:
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Hello,
Frankly, I wish I had taken my own advice and ignored this thread. However, I thought at least put someone in the right direction, ....and at the same time explain why I did not wish to say anymore. I have seen so many of these, and their brothers and sisters, over the years which have been erroneously given the attribution of Victiorian, I thought that I'd at least get that information corrected.
The field has been narrowed considerably. You now know two important things that some 30 hours ago you did not. It is English and it is mid 20th century. No three, it's moulded. Oh, it isn't Davidson ;)
I never know when the Glass Association are going to publish, it depends upon how much they have to fill forthcoming issues, so that is up to them I'm afraid.
Nigel
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Goodness Paul, sometimes you can take comments the wrong way. :) I can clearly see the three mould marks in the circular depression (which could be what you're facetiously referring to perhaps as the Mercedes mark?), and the amount of wear I can see is perfectly consistent with a relatively heavy item from the mid-20C. Nigel hasn't published his information yet - it's expecting a little to much to ask that he make the information public here and now.
Nigel, I've handled a moulded wave-ribbed vase, with I think only four waves and columns between them, in an identical colour and with a base that looks exactly the same. Do you recognise the description as something coming from your mystery manufacturer? (There is a picture of the same piece somewhere on Whitefriars.org's past auctions sites, but I've been through a few years and can't find it immediately.)
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hello Cathy - oops, apologies if I gave the impression that "I'd taken it the wrong way" - nothing could have been further from the truth. Unfortunately, I do have a very bad habit of not using appropriate emoticons :rn: I would defer to Nigel any day - although I suspect that my cynical and sometimes dark humour is not seen on the screen. I was annoyed with myself, mostly for allowing the unusual wear to mislead me - and I genuinely had not seen the three way mould mark on the base.
With my limited experience, I remain ignorant - still - of quite how this piece is made, and when the word mould was mentioned I immediately felt all round for mould seams - and of course, didn't find any. Regarding my comments suggesting Nigel's information was made available immediately - this again was regrettably a case of my slightly dark sense of humour - and I fully appreciate this will be made public at the appropriate time. My errors on this bowl are the first bad ones for a reasonable time - I am improving, albeit slowly, and I hope you will have patience with me :)
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Paul, I have oodles of patience.... I just like drumming my fingers on the desk. :24:
Nigel, we'll all wait patiently for your article - if anyone starts getting antsy about it I'll poke them with my Moderatorial stick! :hj: