Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: Greg. on August 03, 2010, 12:55:10 PM
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Hi All,
Sure someone can help throw some light on this one. Measures 21cm in height, looks Italian and possibly Latticino glass..?
All thoughts appreciated.
Thanks,
Greg
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hello Greg - don't think I can help too much on this style - other than to say that recently I bought a similar sized piece, which is a human figure (dancing), and which I'm sure is generic touristy Murano. The base of mine was similar to yours, with this 'swirl' type of gold decoration on a circular foot. To my disappointment, the gold was simply painted on - as opposed to the real thing which of course has the gold as an inclusion inside the glass. Does the base of yours have the gold inside the glass, or added on the outside?? :)
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The blue and white part is definitly latticino. The spiral base is called something like merletto. Looks to be in ace condition.
Ross
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thanks paul & ross, on close inspection the gold on the foot does appear to have been added to the outside. The threads however, do appear to be inside the glass. Perhaps it is more generic than I first hoped.....
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Hi there:
I am sure someone will be able to tell, I like it. Looks nice to me.
Sure has lots of the remains of the pontil left. Never seen that much left, but then I am still a Newbie.
You might want to take a look at a post of my with a Figurine on a gold-swirled base, here:
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,19131.0.html
...and just some interesting reading about the bases, and swirls...or maybe compare the base gold swirls with yours to see. Just a suggestion.
I think your vase - is very pretty !!
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thanks rose, seems to have its good and bad points, the threads within the glass seem ok, however, as Paul suggests the gold on the outside of the foot raise a few concerns.... :-\
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Is it really outside the glass or just under the surface?
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Hi Christine, the gold on the foot does seem to be on the surface...
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bad form, I know, to 'piggy back' on someone else's post - but this is just to show the similarity of the 'gold paint' on the round foot. I know it's on the outside, because it scratches off with a finger nail. :cry: May well be a copy of a once famous piece by one of the big Italian 'cheeses' (and I don't mean Gorgonzola). I am going to take it back to the charity shop. Just goes to show that you shouldn't buy pieces you know nothing about. :-[
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How extraordinary to be added to the outside! Is this something new we have to worry about? :huh: :'(
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I know nothing of this material - other than the fact that the original 1950's bona fide pieces had the gold marvered into the metal during manufacture - and were probaly not made just for tourists. Looked at quickly, these more recent pieces appear to have the gold in a similar fashion, but it really is only on the outside. As an example of gold being used more skillfully, see http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,35039.msg189748.html#msg189748.......but then again, beauty is in the eye of the beholder....even though the money may not be.....I know which piece I'd rather have ;).
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This looks like a fairly nice piece of glass to me. The zanfirico is varied, reasonably fine, and quite regular. The foot isn't merletto, but filigrana, perhaps gold.
With due respect to Paul, I don't find the term "touristy glass" terribly useful here. I know what Paul means, not particularly distinguished glass made cheaply and simply for tourists to buy. But not all tourist are looking for cheap, and certainly not in the time when going to Venice meant you had money. Some really good glass was bought by tourists, I'm sure, as well as some fairly good glass, like this.
Now if you wanted to sell this to me at a throwaway price I would be very happy to elevate it to a place of privilege in my house. I think it's a pretty nice piece. I've no idea about the maker, btw. I'd defer to Anita there.
David
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I'll have to defer back to you. :P I wouldn't even try to ID without a label to go by. The foot is very nice. The gold looks like it is inside the glass to me. It needs a scratch test on a tiny area to see. It would be unusual for this type of vase to have painted gold. The looseness of the latticino and the casual application of the handles lead me to put this in the "hard to attribute" group, which seems to be the largest group of Murano glass pieces.
I thought I would throw in that most of the glass that we see here in the USA is considered tourist type glass. I'm sure these pieces were the bread and butter money of the glass companies. And they're pretty to us, so we enjoy owning them.
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Hi -- the gold on the base of my figurine does Not scratch off. It is inside the glass, fused with it.
So may I make a possible suggestion:
Could someone have tried to *beef* up the gold coloring on the base to make it more attractive as in $$ wise? Maybe *under* that other gold paint, there is the real gold flecks that is fused in the glass. We all know things come down to the GoD almighty dollar. Many other antiques had *added* silver marks dating things to be older than they were......so maybe, just maybe - this is still a real piece of glass (both of them here) but that more gold paint was added to make it more $$$ -- just like *older silver marks* were added to no-marked silver pieces to make you think they are older.
Worth a thought......
Have you looked under where you have scratched, and is there any gold at all fused in the Glass?
Or could have some of these be made with *clear* bases, but then the over all effect was not liked, and therefore gold paint was added after. I say this (IMHO) because I *assume* that pieces were made in *variable* ways as each glass-maker would experiment with the same design, but change a thing around here and there. What happens if they made some with clear bases, and then just did not like them, or the appeal of them. I would assume (IMHO) that rather than toss out the time, money that still went into to these -- a little splosh of gold paint on the top would solve the problem, and no-one is the wiser when they are sold out of the store -- if they look similar, and IS the tourist who can afford to go to italy, really going to be able to tell the difference. I am not saying they did this to deceive at all -- but a business is a business in any shape or form.
These are just suggestions IMHO only, and only throwing out some possibilities that *could* have taken place. I do not know, and maybe I am stretching it -- but really -- we were not there, so anything is possible.
....and Paul S, before you throw that away -- I would *gladly* take it off your hands to, as it would look nice with my other Figurine -- as I love it.
....and GBarfoot - If you do not want yours either -- I would be *glad* to have it too.
Now we got members wanting them -- So they are Pretty to US !!!
P.S. - When I look at mine, and your guys - it does look like yours is a heavier coating of Gold on the base -- but I still *think* IMHO, you still have the Real Deal under it....IMO :X:
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Hi -- For your viewing pleasure here are some more figurines (30) to look at the bases, hats, swirls, gold (etc) and compare:
Click Here :thup: (http://www.goantiques.com/search/search_results.jsp?keywords=glass+figurines&accountNumber=QGR9089&showMoreOptions=N&channel=&category=&priceRange=&when=&itemType=)
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Maybe Rose's last post could start a separate thread. This thread originally started by discussing a vase.
David
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I have a faint recollection of being told a long time ago that a layer of gold leaf was laid on to hot glass and it would disperse leaving an uneven but interesting pattern , if this is correct would it not be on the surface ? it was a Gaffer that told me this . :-\
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That's different JP, think IoW or Stuart Strathearn. This looks more like powder and just under the surface to me. I too would give it house room (if I had any!); it looks nice quality and older rather than newer to me.
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Hi Christine i know what you are saying but at the time we were discusing two old small Italian birds that i have since been told were probably Venini . :-\
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I know less than any of you on the subject of this type of ware, and wouldn’t dream, usually, of commenting. It was just that I was surprised to find the gold was on the surface and could be scratched with a finger nail – on my figure. As I have already said, ‘beauty is in the eye of the what’s it’, and if anyone has taken offence because I criticized a ‘style’ then apologies, nothing ill intended. Rose, my figure is yours - be on it’s way to you at the end of the week, and if it does turn out to be worth a king’s ransome – please remember me. :)
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Just given the gold on the surface of the foot a scratch at it does come off.....
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Could it be gold leaf applied cold for some reason? I wonder if Adam A could give any insights? :huh:
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Hi Max, it does look very similar to applied gold leaf...
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Now that's a surprise. I would have bet that the gold was inside, which goes to show how tough it can be to tell from pictures. JP: you're right about gold leaf some times being applied to the outside of pieces in Murano, but it does disperse in scattered fragments, rather than staying in a line. Venini and AVeM and a few others used it. You can feel it on the surface but it doesn't come off as it is is fused to the glass.
Still, I think this is a reasonable older piece.
Paul: you've set a new standard for generosity. Be careful or we'll all wanting a choice from your collection. Reading your post was a good way to start the day.
David