Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass Paperweights => Topic started by: thibs23 on August 03, 2010, 03:25:45 PM
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Hi everyone,
Any information on this paperweight would be very helpful. I would assume it is Murano, which means Italian right. Is there a name for this type of design.
Any information would be helpful.
(http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e16/thibs23/IMG_1931.jpg)
(http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e16/thibs23/IMG_1932.jpg)
(http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e16/thibs23/IMG_1933.jpg)
Thank you so much,
Zach
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Fratelli Toso. They made their eggs not so 'eggy' they're more oval. Though worn, I can tell the sticker is what Fratelli Toso used on their weights.
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Lovely weight Zack, do not be tempted to remove either label as to take off the top one could damage the Fratelli Toso one underneath and THAT is the important one as it verifies the maker- worn though the label is.
regards Carol
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I forgot to add that this type of design is a crown weight. A tall one, but a crown nonetheless.
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The black twisted strands are usually referred to as Latticino - since a lattice is a criss-cross of timber.
Ross
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The black twisted strands are usually referred to as Latticino - since a lattice is a criss-cross of timber.
Ross
Latticino specifically refers to white threading. As in Latte the base word refers to milk. All other colors are call filligrano.
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Thanks for that Sach I always thought it referred to the overlapping twisted canes making a lattice.
Ross
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Latticino can be any color. The word refers to the lattice appearance. It is a type of zanfirico. All the internal thread work of Venetian glass is called filigrana or filigree.
Lattimo is white glass. It is the Italian equivalent of milk glass. The "latti" in this case refers to milk.
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Latticino can be any color. The word refers to the lattice appearance. It is a type of zanfirico. All the internal thread work of Venetian glass is called filigrana or filigree.
Lattimo is white glass. It is the Italian equivalent of milk glass. The "latti" in this case refers to milk.
I agree that Latticino is commonly misused to describe other colors but it is correctly used only to refer to white. Check your references.
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I know my last post came off a bit abrupt and I apologize for that but I hate to see misinformation get repeated. Anyway I took my own advice and checked my references. Paul Dunlop's "The Dictionary of Glass Paperweights" (http://www.paperweights.com/bk_dunlop2.htm) confirms my statement. The problem with the idea that latticino refers to the english word "lattice" is that the Italian the word for lattice is "grata". If the Italians were referring to the lattice-like appearance they might have called it gratacino.
Ok, I'll shut up now.
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Paul Dunlop's book? Hmmm. Isn't that the book that has an entry which starts, "Venice a city in France ..." :huh:
Sorry, I couldn't resist it.
But more seriously, the use of the term "Latticino" (or "Latticinio") is perhaps a complex subject for study within glass literature and glassworking around the world.
If "Latticino" only applies to white threads, should coloured threads, used in the same way, only be called "Filigrana"? Newman's "Illustrated Dictionary of Glass" goes to some lengths to define and comment on such usage, but so far I have not felt that I have properly understood what he said, even after several readings!!
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My understanding of proper usage did not come from Dunlop's book. That was simply the first source I found that addressed the question directly. I based my statement upon my training and experience as an amateur glassblower. I think there may be room to question if colored filligrano could not be properly called latticino (even though I do not believe it could). I do not believe that there is any reason to believe that the Italian "latticino" is based upon the English word "lattice" Granted Italian and English both have their roots in Latin and Greek but they are very different in the directions they went from there.
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I started looking for definitions of the word "latticino" because the word is used quite a lot and I've never been sure exactly what it means. I tried the online sources that I trust the most, first Barovier and Toso's online dictionary of glass terms, and then the Loschs' visual dictionary of glass techniques. No mention of latticino in either, I started looking through my Murano books, mostly by the big names, and no mention there, some 15 books in fact. Next, I checked Edward Schmid, Advanced Glassworking Technique, which is the best book I've seen for explaining techniques in a way that's helpful to glassblowers and collectors. For example, he has a great section on how the various types of filigrana are made.
I'll quote, "'Latticino' from Italian latte = milk. 'A style of cane using only white glass color often twisted creating a lattice effect," or so we thought... It's fiction ! For a long time Americans referred to all cane worked pieces incorrectly as 'latticino'. Filigrana is really what we're talking about. The only thing close to latticino is Lattimo - a style of white glass."
Schmid's observations matched my findings exactly. I did find latticino mentioned in one book, Murano Magic, by an American, Carl Gable. It's a useful book, but he's the least authoritative of the authors I looked at in terms of Murano techniques. The term they all use is filigrana, sometimes extending it to filigrana a ritortoli, the term first used in the 16th Century or zanfirico, the terms adopted in the 19th Century. The colours that are used have no effect on the terms used.
My conclusion? We should stop using the term latticino.
David
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I looked around for some definitions of latticino in various places. All that mentioned color at all said either white or color. I'll defer to the latte- root of the word. If the term latticino originally was intended to refer to only white threads, the term has evolved in popular usage to include color. I don't think we can stop using it because it is one of the main keywords used for Murano glass. We would leave latticino collectors searching through a filigrana jungle.:spls: They might never find their way home.
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I agree with Anita's points about modern usage. To return to a specifically correct usage (even if we could be sure of what that was!) would cause confusion.
There seems to be an American-based modern understanding for "latticino" (or "latticinio"). ... ... And there is also an English-based understanding for "filigree" which, according to some early authors, was the English term for the Italian "filigrana"! Why did the English choose to use the different word? Was it due to museum authorities who perhaps preferred certain terms for 18th century drinking glasses with white or coloured threads ("twists") in the stems?
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Just as a footnote I thought I would add a link to Edward Schmid's website (mentioned above). His books look great reading for anyone interested in glass as David suggested !
http://www.glassmtn.com/press.htm#3
p.s.
An example of his work