Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: Pinkspoons on August 16, 2010, 04:48:19 PM
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A recent mystery purchase of, IMO, exceptional quality - but sadly no name to put to it. My initial thoughts were Czech, but I'm not so sure now.
It has a very thin layer of yellow that fades into dark red, and on top of this is a green opalescent treatment. This is cased in a chunky and brilliantly clear glass.
The base is hollow - a curved barrel-shaped cavity with a pushed-in 'nipple' that gives the illusion of a suspended water ripple when viewed from the side. The vase has a slightly tapered form, and it curves towards the base, which is highly polished.
It's just 10.5cm / 4" tall and 6.5cm / 2.5" wide.
Any suggestions gratefully recevied.
(Apologies for the very grassy outdoor pic - it's the only way I could get the opalescence to show without fiddling about with complex lighting set-ups!)
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Nic,
It is a very nice looking piece. My first thought, which I have trouble believing myself, is Murano. There were some very chunky pieces with a degree of opalescence produced in the 1960's - 70's by companies like Seguso Vetri d'Arte and Cenedese. I'm prepared to be told I'm out to lunch, as long as the person telling me is paying.
David
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Murano wouldn't shock me too much as I bought it from an Italian glass dealer... although they thought it might be Scandinavian.
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My immediate impression was Polish because of the way the base uses the pushed in nipple effect. Krosno is selling lots of coloured glass in Australia these days. They like heavy thick glass in many cases. Only reservation is the shiny lip that shows up in the third photo.
Ross
PS. I was facetiously going to suggest Chinese based on the "face" in the red portion of the first photo - complete with appropriately slanting eyes!!!!
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Ha. I never noticed the face in the photo. It's kind of creepy.
The quality far surpasses anything from Krosno, &c., so I think it's probably safe to discount Poland.
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The face is more like a bunny rabbit to me, Nic, not creepy at all.
I think this is a gorgeous piece, and I'm fascinated by the iridescent feature - is it on the inside or outside of the glass?
It reminds me just a little bit of a stunning piece I have by Ian MacDonald (currently working in the studios at Broadfield House), which has a reduction (can't remember what chemicals might be involved, sorry) iridescence covering the inside - it's like a warm-bronze mirror, the glass itself looks black, when the piece is displayed, I think something to do with this mirrory effect, but you can see right through it when you hold it to the light. I'm struggling with colours on my monitor, but the iridesence on yours looks to me as if silver might be involved - yellowy/greeny/bluey/silvery?
As to origin, nobody has suggested Norway yet.......
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Nic:
I hadn't thought of this piece of mine before but there are some similarities, except on mine it's as if the colour in the body are reversed from yours. It's a piece that has always puzzled me as it's well made and very subtle. There are similarities in the base, too. I've plonked for Murano for mine. The only opalescent pieces I know from Scandinavia are some of Palmqvist's Selina and Bengt Orup's Thunder line. It's closest to Thunder but I've got a few Thunder pieces and neither yours nor mine fits there.
Sue: did you have a particular Norwegian company or designer in mind?
David
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:-[
I know very little indeed about Norwegian glass, I'm afraid.
I fell hook, line and sinker for some bits of Benny Motzfeldt and a Gro Bergslein, but it was a case of buying what I like, find out about it later. "Later" hasn't arrived yet.
Hadeland did come to mind, based only on the quality and chunkiness. The inside of your piece looks as if it might be similar to my Ian MacDonald bit. I'll get pics later.
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Sorry - the replies to this thread somehow passed me by.
I think this is a gorgeous piece, and I'm fascinated by the iridescent feature - is it on the inside or outside of the glass?
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I'm struggling with colours on my monitor, but the iridesence on yours looks to me as if silver might be involved - yellowy/greeny/bluey/silvery?
[...]
As to origin, nobody has suggested Norway yet.......
It's more opalescent than iridescent - it looks very much like greeny uranium vaseline glass I've had in the past (actually, I should probably test it under UV!). It's on the inside of the vase.
I've asked a few Scandinavian glass collectors - they've more or less discounted Norway (and Sweden).
I've had a few suggstions of Finnish - Iittala in particular - but I've not been able to find it in the Iittala 125 book. There are similar TW designs, but nothing similar enough. Interestingly, I have had another independent suggestion of SVd'A.
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Nope, no UV reaction beyond the clear glass turning blue.
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You're not talking to yourself, I'm paying attention! When you say it's more opalescent than iridescent, is it on or in the inside glass? (ie has it been applied in some way?)
Wish I could get my mitts on it to study it properly!
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It's on the surface of the glass, on the interior of the vase, and terminates at the rim - so presumably it's a localised heat-treatment.
It's a difficult one to describe because it has so many things going on, despite its simple appearance. :-\
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It's on the surface of the glass, on the interior of the vase, and terminates at the rim - so presumably it's a localised heat-treatment.
That's what looks like has been done. The brown you see when you hold it to the light is what they refer to as opalescent fire. It's quite lovely, imho.
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Oops - I didn't realise that the red/brown was a byproduct of the opalescence process. Shows how much I know! :-[ ;D
So it's not cased glass at all... which is a little frustrating because I came on to say that I'd recently been shown some cased Cenedese vases, unsigned but bearing labels, that share a few characteristics with my vase.
I thought I might be one step closer to pinning down a maker - but perhaps not.
Might "Czech" be eliminated from the title, as I think it's become clear that this is quite unlikely.
Ta. :)
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I'm afraid I have to disagree a little with Cathy here; firstly the vase looks almost certainly to be cased - yes it could be a heat-struck opalescence but the distribution of the opacity and colour strongly suggest it to be cased, the combination of opalescent and clear/ coloured glass is by no means uncommon.
Secondly the brown colour has clearly been created intentionally by the addition of a colouring agent. Maybe we need a chemist here, I don't know what chemicals are used for brown, nor whether the graduation of the colour is also achieved by a heat transformation or not. Either way it's not solely the usual opalescent 'fire'. The 'fire' that people refer to is due to the optical characteristics of opalescent glass. Opalescent glass reflects white light (or more commonly an icy blue-white achieved by adding a trace of cobalt), and so appears whitish in most light. When backlit, however, the 'fire' shows, due to the fact that the glass transmits light towards the red end of the spectrum. Actually this 'fire' can vary from a pale yellow to a deep red depending on the intensity and composition of the opalescence. Either way opalescence doesn't typically cause such a brownish 'fire'. Also if it was just the 'fire' that gave the brown tone then it wouldn't show at all on the outdoor grassy shot where the vase is transmitting relatively little light.
I don't want to sound too pedantic, but it's important to understand how this piece was made and avoid getting sidetracked. As to maker, I'm afraid I can't really help other than to say Italy seems most likely given the technique.
Steven
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Thanks for clarifying the issue - I don't really have very much experience with opalescent glass of this kind.
There does seem to be some correlation, though, with the opalescence and the red/brown colour, as they both terminate at exactly the same point a little over halfway into the vase.
But it does indeed show much in the way of colour regardless of the angle/brightness of the light.
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What I am seeing is some sort of applied black rim, an inner layer which is milky in normal light (Nic's third picture) and brown in his light box (Nic's pics 1 and 2), and then a clear casing. In Pic 3, you can see that the milky glass is on the inside as well as the outside.
Opalescent glass reflects white light (or more commonly an icy blue-white achieved by adding a trace of cobalt), and so appears whitish in most light. When backlit, however, the 'fire' shows, due to the fact that the glass transmits light towards the red end of the spectrum. Actually this 'fire' can vary from a pale yellow to a deep red depending on the intensity and composition of the opalescence.
I am assuming that when the pictures were taken in Nic's lightbox, the glasses appeared that brown colour, and that under normal light they are the milky colour. I have a trio of little birds which are milky white (with only a touch of fire) in normal light, but appear to be a brown very close to Nic's glass when backlit - I'll post photos soon.
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The black rim is merely the shadow/refraction cast by the rim onto the opalescence (which stops just below the inside rim - visible in pic 3).
Under normal light it's still quite browny-red, as well as opalescent. But of the two, unless in very bright, direct, and shadowless daylight, the brown is the dominant colour. That said, it's hard to place the two as distinct layers. When viewed from the inside of the vase, it appears as though the opalescence is on the front and the brown is behind it, but this is also true when viewed from the other side, outside of the vase (if that makes sense?).
It's a hard one to photograph, because there's seemingly so much going on.
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It's a very similar effect to my bird. Here are three pics under three different lighting conditions - standard fluoros, with a flash, and held up against the light to show the glow. There is some reddy-brown in the milky colour under some lights, but in sunlight it's mostly just blue. I was always under the impression this effect was what happened when the heat reactive glass was quite thick, but that may be wrong.
(Excuse Paul's dirty nails in the picture! It was a pain to show the effect.)
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I see what you mean - the brown/opal relationship is very similar. As far as I can tell, the opalescent layer on mine is very thin indeed, so I'm not sure how they got such a depth of colour.
Nice bird, by the way!
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Some pics of my Ian MacDonald piece.
When light is on it, it is completely black (apart from the dichroic bits) and you can't see through it. The inside is an warm pinky beige mirrored surface. When held up to let light come through it, it's really quite clear and see-through - although tinted.
Ian is currently one of the artists in residence at Broadfield house. I love his work.
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and...
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Looks like Zinc Sulphide glass to me - which would make it Russian/ Belo/ Ukrainian or Polish any time after 1950.
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That's a very cheerful vase, Sue! I like the opaque/transparent effect.
Ivo, how sure are you? The quality of the design far surpasses anything I've seen from Eastern Europe and Russia (although, I admit, I'm not too familiar with Russian glass besides self-coloured tableware and vases of mediocre quality that occasionally pop up in the UK), and I've since had a few more 'possibly-maybes' for Cenedese from seasoned Murano collectors.
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:-*
Thanks, Nic. The 3rd picture down is taken through the vase from the inside - the shapes floating around are the dichroic bits. It only reminded me of your piece, because of all the different looks and colours this vase has.
You can clearly see the pinky-beigey mirror effect of light reflected off it in the first pic.
I never cease to be amazed by it.
How can something that solidly black be so see-through?
I love a good dichotomy.
I can't help wondering if there might not be some fabby Russian glass out there - it's a very big place, it's art history is known for being experimental and seriously exciting.
Art of all sorts has always had a very important place in Russia - so important that Stalin banned loads of it, attempted to destroy more loads of it, and imprisoned artists who produced work he didn't like.