Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: GlassIsGood on September 05, 2010, 05:32:59 PM
-
I bought this decanter in the hope that I might find something to shift the 'fogging' it was only £4 and at the very least I've been able to try all sorts of solutions. I now think its that sort of water fogging which bonds to the top surface of the glass and can't be shifted without being physically polished out - which won't be easy given its shape. I understand that you can get companies who will have a bash at polishing these things on rollers, but do you think its worth investment as I've no idea what the polishing process could cost?
The base is just plain cuts into the base radiating out from the centre
-
You have answered the question, you paid 4 pounds for it decanters are 10 a penny these days unless something special , it will probably cost about 12 to 15 pounds to have polished you will still have a decanter that probably wouldnt fetch a lot , if you have the stopper buy a bottle of your favourite spirit for about 12 pounds and use it you will not see the clouding at all while it is in use then you have saved money and are having a good time .SKOL . JP You can buy modern stoppers that will fit most decanters for peanuts .
-
Hi John
I guess that's not a bad idea :thup:
I do have a stopper as it came with one that, if not its own, is a good fit it is a faceted sphere with even hexagons all over it. I must admit I can't see the point in buying a decanter that isn't functional, and I think stopper-less doesn't equal functional. I quite like decanters as glass objects, some of them have lovely pleasing shapes and they are functional too. It's funny I tend to think of a ships decanter as being a 'classic' decanter shape, but when I started to look round there were many, many different shapes. Mind you I'm not keen on the modern plain glass ones they look like little more than old fashioned mens pee bottles LOL
Julia
-
Tip: Don't wash a decanter then bung the stopper back in it while it's still wet. It's a good way to get permanent water damage like this one has. :'(
-
I have come up with quite a good solution to making sure my decanters are dry following washing - my stove has a glass plate which starts cold and very, very gently gets warmer and warmer. It's obviously for plates, but I find it very gently and thoroughly warms the decanters with time for the heat to diffuse uniformally through them and it dries them out a treat.
-
The narrow necked varieties will sometimes fit upside down into the cutlery basket from a dishwasher and drain and dry thoroughly. It takes a couple of days to be sure but is a safe way to do it with no heat that could (even when gentle) cause something to crack.
-
If you are using the decanter as a collectible (not filling it with a beverage) simply place 3/4" of 91% Isolpropyl alcohol in the bottom, swirl it around well & empty it. The alcohol displaces any water & evaporates within 2-3 minutes leaving it spotless. Ken
-
The best and safest way to dry a decanter properly is to give it a final rinse with distilled water, then to put a "wick" of kitchen paper in it for a couple of days.
I believe lead can leach out of crystal into drinks which are put in it, it's not a good idea to use decanters to store anything you intend to consume.
( :angel: Not that I ever consume that vile and addictive drug, alcohol myself. Not for nearly 20 years. :sm:)
-
There is way to bring out the fogginess and dirt etc etc !
the austrian glass maker " Riedel Glass " offers tiny balls ( 2mm in diameter ) and made od steel - there are a few hundreds in a tiny box - just put these with some water into the decanter - and it will be clear within seconds - you should shake the decanter - i ve made probably thousand times - it always worked perfectly !
thomas
-
And a similar product in the UK at a more competitive price
http://www.lakeland.co.uk/magic-balls/F/product/8949
Although I have no personal experience of using the product.
-
They're good for getting muck out of difficult places, I use biological washing liquid with copper "Magic Balls" but, sadly, they don't do anything for water-marked glass.
That's damage to the internal surface of the glass itself.
I think if you've managed to get all your glass clean with steel balls and water, claretjugcollector, that the previous owners of your glass took great care of it!
-
the copper balls are not good - i wouldn`t take them - stay with the steel balls - because the copper will oxidate ( get ugly green and do not work anymore ) :sm:
-
I can confirm that the little balls don't work with this type of fogging, which I understand is degradation/chemical reaction of the outermost molecules of the glass itself. I know because I've tried, along with every other thing I can think of tipping in it (and I'm a chemistry type chemist by training!!)
-
I believe it (the water marking) can be disguised by giving the inside of the decanter a very thin coating of silicon oil. This would render it unusable for storing stuff you intend to drink, and would be a problem you'd have to declare if selling it, but it would fix it for display purposes.
(umm, my copper balls go black, which is copper oxide. They still knock bits of gunge off. Copper nitrate is green - the stuff you see on copper roofs of buildings.)
-
I still think Basil Loveridge is the best option for a perfect job .
-
Or, if you're feeling thrifty, securely tether a sponge to the end of a flexible plastic rod, pour into your decanter a small-ish amount of cerium oxide slurry (cerium oxide can now be bought on eBay quite cheaply), poke your improvised mop into the decanter and use it to rub the slurry against the decanter walls for a couple of hours.
It's a bit laborious, but it does work. And you can do it whilst watching the gogglebox.
-
Pinkspoons - how hard do you need to rub? That ships decanter is not an easy to get at shape, and I doubt you could rub with any degree with pressure, but with a bit of flexible rod I guess it would be possible to slosh it up and down the sides. Would that be sufficient?
-
As a beginner, I notice that this subject comes up possibly more frequently than many others - so I'll bore you yet again.
If the glass is remotely valuable then jp's advice is the most sensible - why spoil the ship for a happ'th of tar. I bought the 'copper balls' because I thought, naively, that copper being softer than steel it wouldn't damage the glass, but it would appear that I was wrong (Thomas), and apparently you can have success with steel - in removing deposits left by hard or soft water. Simple and brief processes such as shaking the glass for a few minutes - after adding copper/steel balls (plus a metal polish and fine abrasive such as cerium oxide) - seem to do almost nothing where there has been real degradation of the glass. Having said that, if you are prepared to spend a long time using power sources/cotton mops/powders/metal polish, then it is a fact that you will achieve substantial improvements. Decanters are not the easiest pieces to clean - inaccessability being a problem (much Finnish glass comes under this heading) - hence balls being useful to reach the parts other mops can't get to. A more complicated, but successful method is to use a tumbler - filling the glass with small pieces of copper wire - plus the metal polish - and run for a day or two. I've not noticed a problem with the copper balls becoming ineffective due to oxidization - a few seconds being hammered around in a vase with cerium oxide and Brasso, soon cleans them, and they are then as effective as ever. I know nothing of chemistry Sue - but I always remember growing the attractive blue copper sulphate chrystals at school. :)
There is a contributor to the GMB -'ipdglasspolishing' - who does/has offered a glass polishing/restoration kit. I haven't tried this - if anyone has, would they like to comment on the effectiveness - or otherwise - of this product. :)
-
Pinkspoons - how hard do you need to rub? That ships decanter is not an easy to get at shape, and I doubt you could rub with any degree with pressure, but with a bit of flexible rod I guess it would be possible to slosh it up and down the sides. Would that be sufficient?
As long as there's some contact between the mop and the decanter wall, there should be sufficient enough pressure - in my experience at least. For awkward shapes, I imagine the it would be possible to adapt a bottle brush - cut off the bristles and somehow attach a sponge (and make sure there's zero risk of any metal components coming in contact with the glass). This would give it some degree of poseability.
But, in any case, you really don't need much pressure.
If the glass is remotely valuable then jp's advice is the most sensible - why spoil the ship for a happ'th of tar.
My first go at polishing out a chip was on a vase with a value of £800-£1000. :-[ In for a penny, in for a pound (or 800-1000).
It survived, and looks as good as new!
-
please expand a little :) - how do you get rid of a chip that easily. ;D
-
I think you would have told me by now if my decanter was remotely valuable. So I think I shall assume that I am not sitting on lump of Waterford and in for a penny in for a pound I've ordered some cerium oxide. Mind you I wonder if a tube of T-cut would work as well?
-
The chip was on a rounded rim, so it was just a case of sanding it level and then polishing out the marks using a fine diamond paste (the stuff usually used for metal tool restoration). The sanding was the laborious part - the polishing took maybe 20 minutes. I'm not sure, yet, how I'd tackle a chip on a flat polished rim... which is a shame, as I've maybe 10 vases that need this kind of restoration, including a swanky Iittala piece. ::)
Mind you I wonder if a tube of T-cut would work as well?
T-Cut is far too soft to have any effect. Been there, done that. ;D
-
Great I won't waste cash on T-cut then - hopefully the cerium oxide will give me something to play with - now all I have to think about is how to get is acting on the interior sides of the decanter. I wonder if I could fit the decanter onto my dads lathe in some way to spin and put our pot of magic balls in it with some of the cerium product. The trouble is the balls will naturally spin to the outer edge - it almost needs to be an off centre rotation. If not I'll try a bendy bottle brush.
-
Don't put it on a lathe, that could be disastrous, a lathe spins much too fast. If you can build a contraption to rotate the decanter once every four or five seconds then the metal balls and/or cerium goo should work, leave it rotating for as long as required, certainly hours, possibly days.
When you have a working device can I borrow it? ;D
John
-
I had visions of the decanter wizzing round at some mega rpm, then shattering and flying off in all directions :o. Re the sanding, believe you need to be careful that you don't put 'flats' on a curved surface - so a sanding block with some 'give' is best presumably. I really would like to hear from anyone who has tried the IPD polishing kit. :)
-
Try lead balls Airgun pellets .
-
Yup, getting the curve 'just so' is the laborious bit. I found that just applying the sandpaper using your hand, rather than a block, gives the best contour response.
I tried the IPD polishing drill attachment - it was FAR too heavy and flexible (unstable) for its purpose and nearly burnt out my hobby drill's motor. That said, it does work well as a hand tool... but I could have easily made one myself, in that case.
-
I think the most difficult bit will be finding something to fit into the neck and yet expand enough once in to meet the sides. Looking at things like sponge scourers, light wire wool and similar with the cerium oxide between the medium and the sides. I think the best thing will be some thing rolling round inside it - airgun pellets might work being an angular shape, but I reckon you would lose the powder inside their structure. I'm also wondering about a handful of gravel, but that might be too coarse. I guess I could while away some hours hand shaking the thing, but something automated obviously has preference, but I don't want to spend cash on too much stuff and would rather utilise what I have. At the moment I am compiling a list of things that I can get to move, lathe, pillar drill, washing machine, honey spinner, bicycle pedals and wondering if there is anyway I can connect the bottle to them without too much effort. Even putting the decanter in my car boot in a padded box full of the chosen scouring medium and just driving round with it for a month or so. At the end of the day I'm only experimenting with a £4 bottle after all. If I ever get it clean I will report back and let you know what I did.
-
quote today from GlassIsGood......'honey spinner'........I thought for a moment that you were trying to say you had found a 'money spinner', because if you had please let me in on the secret. However, don't think I know what a 'honey spinner' is though (bet that gets me a reply or two :))
At the end of the day if your problem is glass degradation, then I don't think you will get inside adequately to abraid the glass sufficiently to restore the piece.
Avoid gravel - it may contain qaurtz, which will be at least 6 on the Morhs hardness scale, and you will only exacerbate the problem. Would suggest also that you avoid steel wool/wire wool - because you need to rub vigorously, and the steel will again quite likely cloud the glass surface.
I don't know whether jp is recommending air gun (lead) pellets from personal experience, or just suggesting them as a possibility - I had previously thought of them, but wondered if they might leave lead smears on the glass?
Try the copper balls with cerium oxide plus some Brasso. Be prepared to shake vigorously for perhaps 15 - 30 minutes, and if there is no improvement, bin the decanter, and try you luck at renovating the inside of something more easily accessible - i.e. a cheap boot sale vase or two. :)
-
Copper balls I've got, the oxide is on its way, and I'll get some brasso. If 15-30 mins is all it might take to see if it is working then its worth a try ;D If it works on this decanter I'll lob the mixture in that blue cone shaped one too as that is also suffering the same problem. I guess you will all be slightly interested to hear how the job goes on? ;-) Air pellets might well still be made of lead, but these days fishing shot is supposed not to be and may provide an alternative to the copper balls, mind you they don't break the bank anyway.
-
Not unless they're fired with enough force! :wsh:
Brasso is surprisingly, in case anybody's interested, good for cleaning ivory.
Tip from my piano tuner for looking after my (elderly) piano keys. :thup:
-
Well its a duff job - 15 mins + of ball swirling with cerium oxide has made no impression. For anyone trying this at home a good piece of advice is to tape the stopper on first otherwise it jumps out of the decanter hits it on the way down resulting in a star burst to the decanter and the stopper :-(
-
Oh dear. At least it wasn't a fabulous and valuable piece. :ooh: