Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: scavo on February 19, 2012, 03:29:40 PM
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I thought I'd posted a query about this vase a while ago but I couldn't find it after an hour of searching through my posts - so apologies if it is a duplicate.
I was clueless when I bought this. I could tell it was quality by the size, thickness, weight and clarity of the crystal.
height about 10 inches (misplaced my tape)
thickness about 1 cm thinning at the mid point and thickening again towards the base.
weight 2.744kg
As I don't normally look at cut crystal, I don't have much to compare it to. Anyhow, recently I picked up some Stuart crystal and noticed that the colour is (as close as my eyes can tell) identical.
Also the marks on the base are similar to those on a Stuart piece I found today. However, I cannot see the Stuart etched mark.
I'm sure at least Stuart can be ruled out quite quickly if it isn't.
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quote..........."I could tell it was quality by the size, thickness, weight and clarity of the crystal." I hate to be Mr. Picky, but I don't think that the first three are essential prerequisites for quality - and modern manufacturing methods can also, usually, create clarity on much cheap glass as well. There are factors that indicate quality i.e. high quality pontil depression, resonance of glass when struck, and method of construction Ii.e. if complex shape and colour combination are of high standard. This does, of course, refer to modern glass, and not to older pieces, which acquire desirablity by other means.
What are the base marks to which you refer - if it's just the star cutting, then probably safe to say that almost every factory produced this effect at some time or another, so attribution to Stuart on this basis is unreliable.
I get the impression that Stuart put their logo backstamp on most of their CUT glass, but I'm sure there were exceptions.
Unless we can find this design in the books, then probably impossible to say it's Stuart - and it's not helped by the fact that much of the run of the mill Stuart designs are not available in standard books. Don't think I recognize this one, but someone else may care to comment.
Sorry to be negative. :)
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The way the rim has been polished looks more Scandi',Stromberg etc... but can't recall seeing any with star cut bases so ::) ;D ;D
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these may be of interest...........
this link to to Stuart - via the Glass Gallery - came courtesy of Ross I think. It may be of interest to others as well, and could be one area to discount. http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/thumbnails.php?album=938
This is another selection - albeit an older catalogue that can from Robert (bOBA)
http://picasaweb.google.com/RobertLBJ/StuartsCrystalGlassGlassCutterMrCorfieldSPatternDrawingsEtcC19171921?authkey=Gv1sRgCK3c9dnFp-bSIA&feat=directlink
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Agree with Keith, more Scandinavian. Glass looks a bit thicker than Stuart ive had.
May be a long search to narrow this one down!
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Thanks to everyone for their comments. It is marvelous that experts are willing to share all this information with the public.
Paul: there is more satisfaction in finding out what it is, than it being something in specific. The only real dissapointment would be that it was something pretending to be something else. It was mostly the colour being similar to other pieces of Stuart that lead me probe the possihbility and repose the question. As for other ways of guaging quality, I'm a little cautious about trying to make it ring. What would you suggest? A wooden spoon? I am still guided by eye, price and intuition. Thanks for the links to the catalogues. I think it will have to done in stages.
Keith: the rim was one of the details that said quality to me.
Andy: Favourite quote from Mr. Kilmister -'the chase is better than the catch'. Apt for collectors!
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in view of your comment re thickness, you may not get much of a ring if this piece is 'flicked' - apologies if my comment was misleading - I was making reference to the ding and lead content more as a general comment applying to quality glass. We all know about the long ring produced when flicking high quality drinking glasses, with a lead content. You can try tapping with a wooden spoon and you may well produce sufficient of the right noise to determine that yours has a lead content. Most decent sized lumps of cut glass (especially vases) have a reasonable lead content, partly because cut lead glass disperses/reflects light much better than non-lead glass, but also because, apparently, glass with a lead content is easier to cut.
If something looks ordinary to you, you can bet it's going to look ordinary to everyone else - thus no real value - try to go for pieces with a makers backstamp - it gives instant provenance. ;D
As we've said, Stuart pieces that can be attributed to a particular designer or design name, are vastly fewer than the shed loads of ordinary mitre cut material, and if you can get your hands of Hajdamach's C20 book, you will see a great difference between the ordinary and the special. The other benefit of having, for example, the Hajdamach book, is that you can learn to recognize the special pieces - which do, believe it or not, turn up occasionally on ebay, and can sometimes remain unrecognized by the masses. The same applies to the better cut pieces produced by Thomas Webb and Webb Corbett. You just have to hope that Mr. B is also not looking at the same time as you. ;) do try and get the Hajdamach book, it really is good value for money, even if too bothery heavy.
P.S. apologies that this is rather long winded.
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Thank you Paul for excellent advice. I have ordered the book.
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Have you considered Atlantis crystal from Portugal. This has similar grooving to my small vase(see photo - sorry about the quality, I must get round to taking it again). My vase has a label & a touch mark.
Ross
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Thank you Ross. There are certainly similarities. Not least the reminiscence of sea life.
Do you have the item to hand or just the old photo? If you could take a look at the grooves and tell me it they are consistent or around about the bottom 1/4 or 1/3 does there seem to be a step? I'm not sure if this is unintentional or by design. Mine has it but I was unable to capture in the photo.
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I would certainly be happy to learn that it is Atlantis.
http://www.nytimes.com/1988/01/31/travel/glittering-crystal-from-portugal.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm
I wonder if they would confirm that it is one of their designs if I emailed them?
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The base of mine is faintly dished - with no star cut. However the side grooves do go all the way to the bottom.
Ross
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I looked at other Atlantis pieces on line - not many found but some items do have a star.
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Received the Hajdamach 20th Century book this morning. Fantastic!
Already found a similar Stuart and Webb design to the item I posted here.
And I think I've ID a Stuart amber jug from 1931. I'll post it later to get a confirmation.