Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: Otis Orlando on March 01, 2012, 03:23:37 AM
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Hi all, Purchased this bowl as I assumed it was made by Davidson Glass, but not too sure now. It was the Chevron design that led me down that path. I did not have time to check it thoroughly during my purchase, but it was not until I got it home, that I then became doubtful, Solely due to the applied coloured speckled glass area design on the outer part of the bowl. I initially thought it was painted on. The dia. of the Sundae bowl, is 10.8cm. Height 8.6cm and weighs 250g. I am not sure whether part of the sundae bowl is pressed glass or not. Within the base stand are a few air pockets. It would be interesting to know how the speckled glass was applied. Any help in identifying and period made would be appreciated.
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The speckled coating is applied by a method called Matthey Crinkles. A sticky "transfer" is applied to the cold glass, which is sprinkled with frit (powdered glass). It is then heated so that the frit fuses. It doesn't wear off. I think your bowl might be Sherdley Glass (but I could be wrong) or is it Sowerby. Frequently seen without the coating.
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The Sowerby ones I have in pink and in blue http://yobunny.org.uk/gallery1/displayimage.php?pos=-109 only have one chevron not three of them, so it could be Sherdley, Christine... I've not seen the three chevron ones before.
Otis, see also here for more about the Sowerby ones: http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,31456.0.html
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Hi all, I have viewed the threads and compared mine and enclined to agree that it is Sowerby. Hopefully someone will be able to confirm? During my search I found some information regarding your comments Christine. http://www.hogelandshoeve.nl/main295.html. The information I found interesting, as I was not aware prior to your info. on how the applied texture was carried out.
Having looked at your thread Anne. There is very similarties to mine, mainly with regards to the overall shape of the sundae bowl. What now concerns me and would be interesting to find out................ is the Chevrons, as yours shows one, were on mine there are three. I have tried researching further to see if I can obtain any further info., but to be frank, I am not having much luck. If this bowl is 'sherdley Glass, I am having great difficulty in finding a bowl similar. Also would you date this bowl around the 1930's or later?
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The crinkles were very much a thing of the 1950/60s, so no, not that old.
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Thanks Christine, at least I can date it now as being vintage. :thup: During the time of my purchase having witnessed it only just being put out on display, I took the opportunity of asking the assistant to let me know if any more comes in. To my surprise on Saturday morning, with excitement from the shop assistant, the lady was quick to inform me, having retained it in their storage, that they have some more. I thought my luck was in to get a set of six, but unfortunately she only had two. :thud: Nevertheless, they are two different colours and together look stunning on display. I am still struggling to find any other that are the same within my research, as I would very much like to get a set of six that are all in different colours. What's my chances of that? Which now leads me to think that these sundae bowls maybe a rarity or specially made/matthey crinkles textured, on request. Here is the picture of all three.
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I really don't think they are rare.
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Thanks for your comments. If late 20th Century ::)..............................Surely I should be able to find some info. on the ones made with three chevrons. What do you think Christine? I am just not having much luck in finding even one the same and there does not appear to be any information on a lot of the sites I have either been referred to or researched. That leads me to my next question. Have you seen this type before and if so, do you have any leads?
I really don't think they are rare
and Annes comment Christine... I've not seen the three chevron ones before.
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I'm sure I've seen them on fleamarkets, usually undecorated, but they don't interest me so I don't buy them. There are undecorated jugs as well. I suspect they were made for Woolworths by Sherdley (but do not take that as fact). The stuff you can find information about is the stuff people collect and have written about. Bargain-end (when it was new) stuff like this from the 1950s/60s is either still in Granny's cupboard or has simply been thrown away.
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::) Oh dear! :o The sheer workmanship that has gone into producing these only to be put in the bin....................................... :sick:
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Truly there isn't much workmanship: a press mould and a lady (almost certainly) on piece work with sticky transfer strips and some trays of powdered glass. Dexterity and speed almost certainly but little workmanship
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Perked up a little bit this morning and with a nice cup of tea and toast thought I'd look at my replies......................................................Oh! dear, ........................off back to bed now :sick:
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I'm not running anything down or saying you shouldn't be interested in it but there is little point in trying to build something into something it isn't. I'm the first to admit I have loads of boring glass.
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Here's some green ones http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1950s-Green-Sundea-Dishes-/280835961709
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Wow! That's a bit ambitious. I only paid 50p each for mine. I will just have to keep my eyes open for ones that could possibly get discarded in the bin.
stuff like this from the 1950s/60s is either still in Granny's cupboard or has simply been thrown away.
. Feeling a bit better, I have decided to keep them as, 'party sundae bowls'. Thanks for your contribution. :thup:
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Now confirmed as from the Sowerby 1/2631 fruit set, supplied in Flint (clear) glass with crinkle finish in turquoise, yellow, blue, green, pink, red. One 7½" bowl plus 6 sundaes.
Source: Sowerby's Illustrated List no. 39 (undated but hand-annotated 1950's). The catalogue has a WITHDRAWN stamp alongside this item. Note: the large bowl is shows as having only one chevron not three. The single chevron version of the sundae is shown in the same catalogue as the 2/2631 set.
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Truly there isn't much workmanship: a press mould and a lady (almost certainly) on piece work with sticky transfer strips and some trays of powdered glass. Dexterity and speed almost certainly but little workmanship
In my book I mention that the production of a range of cast-iron moulds was a very expensive business, meaning the manufacturer would not have taken the decision lightly to produce just a small run. Each mould and plunger would cost hundreds of pounds (sometimes thousands for the more complex 3-part moulds) in the 1950s and when we talk of mass-production, this means a conveyor belt having several of these moulds - sometimes dozens for the smaller items. Given that the value of a pound sterling (£) in the mid-1950s is worth about 40 times that today, the investment was massive. Adam, though, is better qualified to talk of Sowerby's output, having worked there from 1949-56 - just the time when these dishes were produced.
The implication therefore is, as stated by Christine, that they are not rare and, as mass-produced items, there were thousands and thousands produced, not just ones and twos. Because they were of little value, yes, they were often consigned to the bin or the local junk shop when granny got down to two or three items. Naturally, some designs were more successful than others, but invariably the best term you could apply to mass-produced, press-moulded glassware is "scarce".
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It's taken a year for me to build up the strength to view this post since comments had made me very ill. :'( 'Scarce', that sounds better! ;D
I had a party over the weekend and these bowls were used. I wasn't surprised by the interest shown into where I had got them from.
Thanks to you all, for helping me identify these beautiful bowls.
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"Scarce" is "the best term" you could apply to mass-produced press-moulded glass, but these could be "common" of course. Christine is correct that it's unwise to build them into something they're not.
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Over the years I've had through my hands just two complete 2631 1+6 harlequin sets, both of which sold incredibly quickly. Part of their appeal is the neat way that the six dishes nest in a ring inside the bowl. They don't need subjective description, but the sets are not easy to find complete.
One here for the marketing experts. Should the dishes be arranged clockwise or anticlockwise in the bowl for maximum appeal? And is any sequence of colours preferable?
Bernard C. 8)
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Truly there isn't much workmanship: a press mould and a lady (almost certainly) on piece work with sticky transfer strips and some trays of powdered glass. Dexterity and speed almost certainly but little workmanship
In order to make an item for the market, firstly the PIP method most always apply. Planning Information Preperation. That to me is 'workmanship' and time by man/woman would of been most certainly a contribrutary factor in the setting up process regardless on ones taste in the end product/s.
I'm the first to admit I have loads of boring glass.
I'm most certain Christiane that someone out there would like to get their hands on some of your 'lovely' boring glass. ;D
I don't have/purchase boring glass only glass that interest me or to pass on to someone else that may have an interest.
Christine is correct that it's unwise to build them into something they're not.
That definately was not my intentions, for the simple reason, that I am no expert on the subject matter, hence, my initial query as a none-specialist. ::)
Initially I was unaware that these were mass produced. So yes, I do agree that 'Scarce', would be a better way of describing the bowls. Thank you for highlighting that to me. Please excuse my hinglish. Unfortunately it was not one of my most popular subjects. Maths, oh yes! maths, that interest me cuz, I needed to make sure I wazn't ripped off whilst in a game with marbles. ;D Talking about marbles, I'm sure there was some discussion about setting up a forum on the GMB site? I'm sure collectors would be interested.
Thanks for the info. Bernard. With the info. gathered I'm off to see what else I can find. By the way, have you any pics? :)
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... By the way, have you any pics?
No, unfortunately they sold much too quickly for pictures.
Bernard C. 8)
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No worries, many thanks for your info. :)