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Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass Paperweights => Topic started by: donaldf on December 16, 2012, 04:07:41 PM

Title: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: donaldf on December 16, 2012, 04:07:41 PM: Hi all.

Bought this weight with a description that it was 19th cent baccarat, but I suspect it is 20th century. It has a baccarat sticker on the base which I am guessing was an invention of the 20th cent..... Is it a baccarat?

Don

Mod: As no indication of permission for use has been given, the cropped versions of the eBay images have been removed in accordance with board guidelines. For now, please refer to the closed eBay listing (http://cgi.ebay.fr/sulfure-presse-papier-ancien-XIX-siecle-de-baccarat-/150960810114?pt=FR_JG_Céramiques_Verre&hash=item2325f72882) to view images.
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: pooleandpaperweights on December 16, 2012, 08:50:48 PM: Looks like Baccarat Dupont, seems to be some very different dates over these, some saying 1850's, others 1920s/30s. Did you buy it on ebay recently?
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: donaldf on December 16, 2012, 08:58:20 PM: yes I bought this on friday on Ebay france
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: tropdevin on December 16, 2012, 09:38:35 PM: ***

On the limited information the images provide, I would vote for antique Baccarat. Can you post a profile view that shows where the canes are set relative to the base, and also the shape of the dome?

Alan
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: donaldf on December 16, 2012, 11:03:44 PM: Hope these are better images

Don

Images removed. Please see "Mod:" comment in initial post.
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: donaldf on December 16, 2012, 11:16:34 PM: Sorry if I have breached any guidlines.... I have bought the weight but as yet it has not arrived with me... I was just interested to know if it was as described

Don
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: donaldf on December 18, 2012, 05:28:04 PM: Hi All, while doing some research on early Baccarat Paperweights, there is reference to 'paper labels applied to paperweights from 1860'. When would have production of this type of weight ended ....if it is from this period?... This could pin down the date of this weight to a period from 1860 to ------?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baccarat_%28company%29

Many thanks
Don
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: tropdevin on December 18, 2012, 07:58:34 PM: ***

I have heard of paper labels from the 19th century, but never seen any, so a cast iron guaranteed example would be fascinating. As for the period when Baccarat made weights, I think that they kept producing at a relatively low rate all the way from the 1860s throught to the 1920s - 1930s. There are pansies and rock grounds around that are engraved as presents from the Eiffel Tower (also cast iron ;D ), so they were still making paperweights in the late 1880s - 1890s.

Alan
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: donaldf on December 31, 2012, 04:06:53 PM: Hi All, I have now got the paperweight, and have taken these two photos, one of them showing the paper label that is on the base. It is in the same style as the modern acid etch, but is clearly old. I have read that labels were applied from 1860, so is this weight from the 1860's?

Happy New Year to all and hope 2013 is a prosperous one for you all

Don
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: tropdevin on December 31, 2012, 04:35:24 PM: Hi Don.

Nice to see the label image. I have tried to find an original source for the assertion that Baccarat used paper labels from 1860 onwards, but can only find dubious things like eBay guides or simplistic websites (the sort that peddle nonsense by just repeating out of date or incorrect material from elsewhere - for a laugh (or cry) look at some of the Hobbizine stuff on English paperweights (http://www.hobbizine.com/page1064.html)!). Can anyone point me in the right direction for the Baccarat label information?

Looking at your first picture, and seeing the canes in detail, I think this may be a Dupont weight from the 1920s. Can you provide a side view image? Dupont tend to have rather straight sides near the base, and the canes set low down in the dome.

Alan.
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: donaldf on December 31, 2012, 05:26:33 PM: Hi Alan,

Here is that photo.

Don.
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: tropdevin on December 31, 2012, 05:54:26 PM: ***

Hi Don

Thanks. The canes are certainly set low, but the dome shape - if original - looks more like an older piece to me!

Alan
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: donaldf on January 01, 2013, 11:58:30 AM: Happy New Year to All.

Alan, this was the article I found :-

http://www.pressglas.de/English_Homepage/Texts/About_Baccarat/about_baccarat.html

Don
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: tropdevin on January 01, 2013, 12:46:39 PM: ***

Thanks Don - and Happy New Year to you.

That is certainly a respected website. I read the article as saying that the trademark was registered in 1860, but that the first reference to all products bearing a label is not until 1893. So it is a little unclear whether the label was used from 1860 onwards.

Alan
Title: Re: I don't think this is nineteenth century ?
Post by: donaldf on January 02, 2013, 10:01:27 AM: Alan

good morning... raining here, so technically it's the wettest day of 2013 :)

.... So to sum-up, the weight has the look of an 1860's example but could have been made anytime from 1860 up to to a period where the Dupont upright profile came into play which was when???

Don