Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: pegwellbayantiquities on March 09, 2013, 05:46:09 PM
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Hi all, from the research I've done on the dimpled body and crimped spout on this carafe I've placed it in the Victorian era. Would anyone be able to give me a manufacturer, more precise dateon the piece and also tell me about the significance of the '36' and the 'w' shape on the spout? All info would be greatly appreciated :D
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The 36 indicates it's a decanter missing its stopper, which would also have been numbered 36. If you mean the marks in the necks by the W, i think they are just striations in the glass
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ahh i see thus deeming the stopper for carafes and decanters 'rocking horse poo' so to speak :P would you agree with me on its age? i've seen quite a few expensive examples of glass this age with this pattern.. so here's hoping! ;D
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trefoil shaped pouring lips seem to be associated with the art nouveau period - somewhere near the end of C19 and on towards a little before the 14 - 18 war - French possibly in origin of design.
Don't know whether the rest of the decanter might be the same design origin though - seeing the stopper might have helped perhaps.
Do people think this is a dip moulded pattern - then blown to expand, with the foot being added afterwards. The Victorians were very keen on their machine etching, wheel engraving and cutting - but this moulded design looks almost as though it owes more to the likes of Webb in the first quarter of the C20. Seems to have a very larg pontil depression.
In fact there was a Webb pattern from the early 1930's with an identical 'fir cone seed' pattern - when you say you've seen a few expensive examples of this pattern, might one of those have been Thomas Webb?
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Haven't looked at any thomas webb, any chance you could post a picture of what you're referring to my friend? Yes the pontil is very large, in fact almost as large as the base of the whole carafe! This does have a hint of the nouveau about it but the dimpled pattern does appear in alot of victorain examples, perhaps its late victorian early edwardian?
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regret I don't possess such a decanter, unfortunately - it was a book image only of which I was speaking, and I can't copy that. I'd suggest that the examples you've been looking at are, as you suggest, very late Victorian/Edwardian. You may have difficulty in progressing any sort of attribution much further - I take it that there's no sign of a backstamp of any kind. Do the digits look Continental, or very British - there is a difference in the style of script which sometimes is noticable.
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Ahh fair enough, i was just asking on the off chance :P No sign of a backstamp but as shown in picture two the '36' is quite neat and swirly - what this indicates i'm not quite sure! ::)
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I have the same and always thought it to be Webb , i also have a large one :-[ probably holds a couple of bottles , i will dig them out later . I do believe Paul has it about right tho .
Just remenbered i have a set of glasses same pattern marked Webb but they didnt come together and slightly brighter glass . I think .
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Ahh i see, we might have a development for this piece, i just examined it with a better magnifying glass and found this etched mark next to the '36' on the rim, it looks like a 'W' and looks intentional due to its harsh direction changes making me think that this is not just an age related scratch, does this help anyone out with an ID?
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almost certainly nothing intentional - just part of the wear and tear of the history of this piece, unfortunately.
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What a shame lol! I got all excited, the harsh direction changes makes me wonder how this scratch arrived in such a strange place and what caused it ::) oh well, so basically i'm most likely looking at a late victorian, early edwardian carafe most likely by webb? Not bad for a £1.50 investment! 8)
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It's not a carafe; it's a decanter without a stopper, unfortunately
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Ergh my bad i meant decanter ... long day ... the hunt for a suitable stopper begins
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hate to be a pessimist about your chances of finding a stopper, but........... Stoppers for cut and moulded bodies will often reflect the same decoration as the decanter, which you might think should make life a bit easier when hunting for the missing part. Unfortunately, the chance of finding the correct stopper is just about zero - although that shouldn't stop you from looking - there are collectors of stoppers, and good early ones especially coloured examples are great pieces for show. There are occasions when it's woth picking up a 'stopperless' decanter - if for example the pattern is rare and and valuable or whatever, but if the body is of no known provenance then it's best to leave alone - there are plenty of bodies that still have the top bit.
However, if you are looking, please do remember that I need stoppers for Webb's 'Ribbonette' and Stuart 'Villiers' bodies ;) ;)
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Haha yes i know, stoppers that fit are notoriously difficult to find however i do have a few contacts that collect stoppers so i may have a little luck finding at least a half decent fit with a nice bulbous top! I'll keep an eye out for the ones you need to :D