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Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => Murano & Italy Glass => Topic started by: glassobsessed on April 05, 2013, 05:29:19 PM

Title: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: glassobsessed on April 05, 2013, 05:29:19 PM
This fish is quite light in weight and about 20cm long. Anita has one with a similar form in the Murano Zoo but there are enough differences that maybe this one is from another factory, the clear example here (top right): https://sites.google.com/site/muranozoo/fish-invertebrates-4

When I bought this one I passed up two more, same form, slightly smaller and blue. Some shark had been nibbling the tails.

My first thought was Salviati but that is probably just the gold leaf talking. Any ideas?

John


Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: johnphilip on April 05, 2013, 07:18:00 PM
They look  similar to the Salviati menu or place card  holders but bigger , possibly part of a table service  .
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: TxSilver on April 06, 2013, 03:14:21 AM
They look like the Fratelli Toso fish to me, but other people could have made them, too. I don't know if Salviati did fish with the large lips like this. However, there is a lot I don't know about this type glass. The eyes and mouth of yours are different from the FT fishes I've seen, but it may be another company -- I don't know.
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: rocco on April 06, 2013, 09:45:37 AM
I have a fish vase similar style to your fish, and they seem very hard to attribute >> http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,50228.0.html (http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,50228.0.html)

The eyes in yours are quite unusual, though, so maybe that can be linked to a maker one day...

Michael
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: glassobsessed on April 06, 2013, 05:39:01 PM
Thank you JP, Anita and Michael for taking a look. If part of a table service I wonder what their function could be?

John

Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: johnphilip on April 06, 2013, 06:40:22 PM
Maybe thats why the mouth is so big to hold something .... like ice and tongs . :-\
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: TxSilver on April 06, 2013, 06:56:17 PM
I've seen them called salts, and have even seen two of them with little spoons. Maybe it is what they are.
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: glassobsessed on April 07, 2013, 06:59:42 PM
Maybe not ice, it would be a bit small for today's 'standard' sort of sized cubes but salt would fit, the interior slopes away from the mouth so it would not flow out. Were the spoons you saw made of glass Anita?

Just a random thought but could you serve caviar in one of these fishes?

Thank you both, this little fishy is turning out to be a really fun item.

Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: TxSilver on April 07, 2013, 08:52:39 PM
I don't really understand why why come people call these fish salts. I believe the old salt dishes were ones that actually did hold salt. People could stab some piece of food, then dip it in the salt. Sounds like a great way to get high blood pressure to me.  I can't picture trying to dip every piece of food into the fish's mouth. Meal would be a slow thing.

Caviar holder! Now that seems a perfect use for them. And the little spoons fit into that idea.
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: johnphilip on April 08, 2013, 08:14:21 AM
I thought!!! too big for salt , Caviar did cross my mind or crushed ice the upturn would hold it in . I still go with part of a table service with the menu holders , I believe several firms made them . :-\
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: chopin-liszt on April 08, 2013, 10:13:09 AM
I thought caviare was supposed to be served from a double walled container which held ice under the stuff.  ???
It looks too delicate to be shoving metal utensils into it, and it doesn't really look that practical for salt.
But where on it is there something to hold a place card?
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: johnphilip on April 08, 2013, 10:48:05 AM
The small ones are for place cards scroll back , they have a receptacle for it .
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: Ivo on April 08, 2013, 11:04:08 AM
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,43465.msg242355.html#msg242355

another age, another fish, another technique but maybe same usage?
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: flying free on April 08, 2013, 10:15:42 PM
they remind me of spoon warmers - but I'm sure we've had this discussion before and one wouldn't use glass as a spoon warmer - hot water/metal and glass not a good combination.
m
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: flying free on April 11, 2013, 10:20:53 AM
http://www.alafacondevenise.fr/affichage_dyn_objets.php?action=showfull&vpic=123&gll=1&tpic=32&maxp=53&page=1
this is an old one here 18th century and  called a table epergne.
I think the owner of the site has written a book on 15th to 17thc glass so I'd guess if it had another function it would have been noted.
It seems it is simply known as a table epergne.
m
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: glassobsessed on April 11, 2013, 03:48:59 PM
Sorry, been distracted by family issues recently.

I find it hard to see the function of this fish as a spoon warmer, it is too small, it might work for a teaspoon sized spoon but that is about it. Good to see another example M thanks, that one looks early 20th century to me but what do I know! ;D

John
Title: Re: Hollow fish with gold leaf
Post by: flying free on April 11, 2013, 04:55:32 PM
pretty sure the dating on that one is correct  ;D - they have a flask on there that sold for Euro 38,000 8 years ago  :o
m