Glass Message Board
Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => Murano & Italy Glass => Topic started by: glassobsessed on September 08, 2015, 08:39:25 AM
-
A nice example of a girasol goblet with enamelled decoration, late 19th century, lots of opalescence. Hollow stem with folded foot, snapped marks on the base and at the bottom of the bowl, 11 cm tall.
Does anyone know if this kind of bowl shape has a name?
John
-
Sorry, can't help, but it is lovely! :)
Michael
-
I'm waiting for flying-free to comment, so far succeeding in not drenching my keyboard with drool.
I've looked up girasol - it refers to the fire in the opalesence; or it's a jerusalem artichoke;
but an images search just came up with tons of sunflowers... ;D
-
Sorry Sue, girasol is the Italian for sunflower but also the term they use to describe milky white opalescent glass.
Also, I am confident this was made by/for Salviati as there is a blue version with a similar shape (four bulges instead of eight) and more importantly the exact same enamel band, it is shown on page 16 of Exquisite Glass Ornaments, edited by Rosa Barovier Mentasti.
-
I was just getting myself ready to understand what might be said. I'm settling in to this thread, ready to learn.
It's quite something, isn't it? Folded foot too! 8)
-
That's really pretty - gorgeous enamelling, a mix of the traditional beading with something more contemporary. Really unusual. There isn't anything with enamelling like that in the Barr book.
Sue according to the Museo del Vetro re Girasol glass '...This glass is slightly opaque due to the presence of lead hydrogen arsenate crystals in the glassmaking mixture...'
I've not got to the bottom of what I'm trying to research but as far as I can tell (don't quote me), Girasol glass seems to have been popular during the 1600s and first 10 years of 1700s ish, then a 150 year gap and then popular again from 1860 ish. It's considered dichroic glass because it changes colour depending on whether the light is reflecting off it of being transmitted through it.
m
-
Is there any real difference between what is called girasol and what I would call (generically) opalescent?
-
girasol is .... the term they use to describe milky white opalescent glass.
There should be a rule about quoting yourself!
-
;D
I don't know - my Grandpa used to talk to himself and whenever he was criticised for doing so, he would reply; "I can't think of anybody better to be talking to." :)
-
Of the two types of opalescent glass, the one made with bone ash shines through fiery while the later one made with arsenic does not.
It looks as if this piece is indeed by Salviati from the 1890-1910 period.
-
Is there an opalesence which is just milky blue and yellow then, no red fire? The arsenic one?
I've got a bit of contemporary Polish studio glass which is absolutely full of fire (the whole reason I bought it) brand new in Poland, from the Institute of Glass and Ceramics showroom in Krakow.
-
Ambrosiaschale is how this one is described and yours appears to be a 'take-off' of exactly the shape of this bowl amazingly so there must be a name for it somewhere I'd guess - maybe ambrosia is the name in Italian as well?
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Ambrosiaschale-Riesengebirge-1-Halfte-18-Jhd-H-9-5cm-/391229252287?hash=item5b1714a2bf
Wikipedia says
'Ambrosia
In ancient Greek mythology, ambrosia is sometimes the food or drink of the Greek gods, often depicted as conferring longevity or immortality upon whoever consumed it. Wikipedia'
m
-
Ambrosia dish is the generic name for this scalloped shape - I've never come across it either. Probably a term used by museum people.
there is no law that says all opalescent glass is this or that - there are many recipes, with tin, arsenic, bone ash, all three or 2 or 1 . In studio glass anythjng may happen.
-
Harold Newman: An Illustrated Dictionary of Glass states ...
ambrosia dish. ... type of dish ... asymmetrically shaped ... form of an oval bowl ... irregularly lobed rim ... small curling handle ... stemmed foot ... ... ornate decoration rococo style ...
On that basis, stemmed bowls with regular (i.e. symmetrical) shapes and without a small curled handle and with no ornate rococo decoration, are not really "ambrosia dishes".
But perhaps the term has evolved (among museum curators etc.) to include all stemmed bowls with some fancy shaping which may be used for serving all sorts of foods - maybe even Ambrosia creamed rice, straight out of a tin can. :)
-
Definitely a symmetrical shape this one.
Thanks all, I had wondered about scalloped but I think if I am asked about it I may just whistle quietly and pretend I have not heard!
Edited to add:
A little more info from the book I mentioned in my second post relating to the similar glass: it is described as four lobed...form derived from a type of Bohemian Baroque glassware...similar to a green goblet donated by Salviati & C in 1876 to the Museo Artistico Industriale di Roma...two more almost identical held at the Museo Borgogna in Vercelli.
Sorry - completely overlooked the notes in the back of the book. :-[
-
I agree Kev - I think it might have been 'appropriated' to use on lobed bowl on a stem but not necessarily by museum people :)
The bowls I often see described as Ambrosia bowls do have the curled bit and are boat shaped ish. So they are probably described as per your description.
John, I have seen a piece described as end 16th century Venetian, with 6 lobes, in a French museum collection . It isn't described as an ambrosia bowl, just as a bowl with a stem.
m