Glass Message Board
Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => British & Irish Glass => Topic started by: agincourt17 on August 08, 2016, 01:20:06 PM
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The Sowerby pattern books for 1895 and 1898 shown a glass swan in two sizes - large, pattern 1852, and a smaller pattern 1852½. It would seem to be an unregistered design.
The only photo of the pattern 1852 swan that I know of is a beautifully-detailed turquoise vitro-porcelain version shown as colour plate 30 in Sheilagh Murray's "Peacock and the Lions..." (Oriel Press, 1982). She gives the size as 16cm long by 12 cm high, and bearing the peacock trademark. The shape and surface detail differ significantly from the Burtles & Tate swans, and to that from Jane Webb &c.
Here are some photos of a similar swan in opalescent yellow-green uranium glass. The swan has no identifying marks. It is 15cm long x 11cm tall x 7.5cm wide, and weighs 392 gm. The uranium glass is highly reactive to UV light. The detail is not so crisp as Murray's example, but I presume that is largely due to the different working and finishing properties of the two types of glass.
(Permission to re-use these images on the GMB granted by Kevin Collins).
Does anyone have photos of the pattern 1852 swan to show in other colours, please?
Does anyone have photos of the smaller Sowerby pattern 1852½ swan to show, please?
Fred.
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It would surprise me if this swan were Sowerby, as I can't think of anything else Sowerby in this "primrose pearline" like uranium glass. Other Sowerby opalescent glass is not uranium and other Sowerby uranium glass is not oplaescent
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Perhaps I should have stuck to my initial idea of putting a question mark at the end of the topic title, Christine, because what you say about Sowerby opalescent glass and their uranium glass seems to be the rule.
On checking back though my reference photos, there is a single Sowerby piece made from 'pearline-like' opalescent glass with a strongish yellow base colour - a small 2-handled dish pattern 1254½, Sowerby RD 314279 of 18 September 1877. Unfortunately, I don't have a record as to whether it was UV-reactive or not, but certainly other opalescent versions of this pattern (usually with a more-or-less uniform opalescence on quite pale base colours) were definitely not UV reactive.
Other than Davidson, Greener & Co. made opalescent uranium glass items from as early as 1891, but they never registered a design for a swan.
I will be interested to see if anyone posts photos of a marked Sowerby pattern 1852 swan in other colours.
Fred.
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Maybe they made a very small batch ???
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Hi Fred,
There is a clear glass Sowerby swan in the V&A collections, see: http://collections.vam.ac.uk/item/O3859/swan-flower-holder-sowerby-ellison-glassworks/
It looks similar to your 'primrose' version Fred, but not quite the same.
Kind regards
Nick
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Thank you, Nick.
The detail is certainly much crisper on the V&A example, but that may perhaps be because reheating the freshly-moulded piece to produce the opalescence has partially melted the detail in the hottest parts.
Fred.
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Fred
I also have the same swan in 2 sizes.
http://e-britain.co.uk/victorian_pressed_glass/gallery_unknown.htm
They have the same mottled base and both have a lot of rough flashing, especially around the heads.
Sorry, never have been able to attribute them.
Mike
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Thank you, Mike. Very nice photos.
Interesting that you have the swan in two sizes (like the Sowerby swans), but then again the Burtles & Tate swans also came in several sizes.
The mottled base is certainly unlike any Sowerby piece that I have come across before so I agree that a firm attribution for the swan(s) is still lacking.
Fred.
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Hi All,
I must admit to being really confused by the attributions of pressed glass swans in general. Maybe it's the camera angles of the photos, but the number of feather bars on the wings seem to differ quite often (especially in Burtles Tate attributions) In the photo on the V&A site, for example, there are four bars of feathers on the wing whereas the Sowerby pattern picture (larger bird) and Fred's photo show three. Could this be a differing mould, camera position, picture definition, incorrect attribution, or is this just me assuming the V&A swan is the larger version or do I need an optician or psychiatric help ;)? Mike's photos also show three wing bars, but I assume the base rules out the Sowerby attribution?
Oh and thanks Fred for your reply to my email, much appreciated.
Kind regards
Nick
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The most reliable indicator for the Burtles, Tate & Co. swan attributions (irrespective of the size) is the RD number 20086 (registered 8 January 1885) that they usually bear.
Similarly, the Jane Webb & Joseph Hammond etc. swans normally bear the lozenge for 21 Dec 1874 - Parcel 4 (RD 2880150).
Otherwise, without some kind of manufacturer's markings, it seems that really firm attribution of a glass swan to a particular manufacturer is often a problem (especially in view of different sizes, moulds etc.).
I gather that a similar problem occurs with unmarked glass 'hens on baskets'.
Fred.
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Thanks for that Fred. I've asked the V&A for more details on their attribution, and just found their swan's dimensions - Height: 10.7 cm, Width: 15.5 cm maximum, Depth: 8.2 cm, which I think, put it in the larger category (1852)?
Kind regards
Nick
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"The most reliable indicator for the Burtles, Tate & Co. swan attributions (irrespective of the size) is the RD number 20086 (registered 8 January 1885) that they usually bear."
Thank you Fred for your helpful info, do you know how long after the 1885 date the Burtles, Tate & Co Swans were made?
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Welcome to the GMB vonann.
Unfortuately, I've no idea how long after their registration date that the Burtles, Tate & Co. swans would have been made, but the firm was still registering designs as late as 1914, and appear to have been still making glass items into the early 1920s.
Fred.
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regret I know less than nothing about swans, but can anyone say why the V. & A. should describe their clear glass example as 'press moulded opaline glass' - I wasn't aware there was such a thing as clear opaline.
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Thanks Fred, that gives me a date range, first piece from that company, was a lucky find.
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I come across this thread so thought I’d ad these as i believe they are the Sowerby Swans (small and unmarked) dad also has a clear one. Regards Mike
These Opalescent green ones do not glow.
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there is a good line drawing of the swan here. Yours look the same as this line drawing I think:
https://www.carnivalglassworldwide.com/swanning-around.html
https://www.carnivalglassworldwide.com/uploads/3/7/0/9/37096651/2859753.jpg?292
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Thanks I’ve not seen that page before, the Sowerby 1885 catalogue shows only some items were marked with a lozenge or peacock so it’s not unusual for pieces from this period onwards not to be marked.
Mike
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Mike, your small swans are in the 1892 catalogue page 38, pattern number 1852.5
http://www.victorianpressedglass.com/pdf/sowerby/sowerby_1892.pdf
Looks like they made a smaller version of pattern number 1852, as you say not unusual for them not to be marked at this date.
I have a few marked pieces in the same green stained, opalescent, Blanc de Lait glass.
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Mike,
Thanks our frosted one is also unmarked, cheers Mike