Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: scotglass on September 28, 2017, 04:29:00 PM
-
Hi all
I would like some help to identify this piece of glass which I have picked up.
Its 11cm tall and 9.5cm wide with a polished pontil and some wear to the base.
Thanks for any help with this.
Carol
-
Looks like Walsh to me ;D
-
Hope you can see this.
Carol
-
Hi
If it is Walsh can anyone date it roughly for me?
Thanks Carol
-
Not got my book at the moment, someone else is bound to know, look what's on the shelf next to me ::) ;D
-
Well well its the same how interesting!
Not my usual type of glass so at least I now know what it is.
wont be keeping it but its nice all the same.
Carol
-
white backgrounds don't help when showing clear glass, and regret I can't seem to blow these pix up, so not seeing details too clearly.
I'm assuming Keith's comments re Walsh might have been due to the pale centre to the vine leaves, which was a Walsh trade mark in their engraving of these things, and seen in their 'Fruiting Vine' pattern - I think every piece of theirs I had, with vine leaves, showed this characteristic. Assume the rest of the decoration is cut, but not sure. On page 38 of Reynolds 'The Glass of John Walsh Walsh' their is a b. & w. picture which includes something very similar in shape to Carol's glass, although it's described as pressed glass (it's not in fact a piece of 'Fruiting Vine'), so Walsh certainly made this shape with the almost non-existent stem. Whether Walsh made this shape in cut/engraved glass I've no idea, and certainly haven't the enthusiasm to search the pattern drawings at the back of Reynolds.
Walsh backstamps can be the devil to find, and even having found it the next time you look it seems to have disappeared. According to Reynolds, Walsh glass with backstamps can be dated approximately, and allocated to one of two separate groups, depending on the wording of the backstamp. Apparently the earlier of these was used 1926 - c. 1930 and shows simply the word WALSH ............. the later mark is indicated as having been used c.1930 - 1951, and shows as WALSH over a curved ENGLAND - doubtless though there was an overlap in the period these were used.
Having looked through Tim Mill's 'Rummers', it seems very unusual to have a rummer with such an extreme rudimentary stem, especially coupled with the absence of any vestige of a collar or knop, and I did wonder if this one might have been copying a monteith or bonnet glass, but don't think so - they tended to be a tad shorter .............. so can't really think what else this might be called, other than rummer.
Unfortunately, none of the features that I can see on Carol's piece are singular enough - in usage in the glass trade - to help with specific dating ..... grape and vine decoration and polished pontil depressions have been going for ever and a day, and slice cutting (if that is what this piece has) was used for a very long time too. But of course if this is Walsh then we will know it's probably middle third C20, and even if without a backstamp then a v. g. chance of Walsh in view of the pale leaves.
I can't see if Carol's and Keith's glasses are identical just from these pix, but perhaps Keith's does have a Walsh backstamp, although I'm not sure from Keith words whether he is saying that is so, or not??
So - over to you Keith :)
-
Thanks Paul ::) ;D no, mine has no signature, lots of wear, I was just hoping mine might be and thought Carol's might also be, clear as mud as usual ::) ;D ;D
-
thanks Keith :) At one time I had five or six different shapes of Walsh drinking glasses - all with 'Fruiting Vine', but don't recall having a rummer, but that's not to say the factory didn't make one. Easy to understand that tumblers, goblets, wines etc. would be made mid C20 in view of the common usage of such specific shapes, but a rummer might be thought of as anachronistic to the point few people would buy such a shape - possibly as they wouldn't know it's historic use. Maybe though, in view of the grape and vine decoration, it was just a novelty shape for red wine? - but I think you're possibly correct about the maker in view of the pale leaves.
My comments re Tim Mills book which I forgot to explain, was that the absence of collar or knop and ultra short stem, convinced me this piece wasn't older than C20 - but that's just my opinion.
quote .............. "On page 38 of Reynolds 'The Glass of John Walsh Walsh' their is a b. & w. picture etc. ..... " who writes this rubbish ;)
-
having just browsed through Silber & Fleming - which appreciate is c. 1880 and not middle third C20 - surprised to see that they describe shapes which we know as rummers, as goblets. In fact it appears they were in the habit of describing many capacious shaped bowls like this as goblets, and nowhere do they mention the word rummer.
-
Looks the standard size for a water goblet from a deco glass and jug set, on going to the cupboard to get a couple of examples i have discovered they have been recycled.
-
Probably shouldn't put this here as we're not in 'British', but since there's a connection of some sort................
Found three 'Kenilworth' cut wines this morning for £1 each, all marked WALSH over ENGLAND, but so faintly I doubt the charity shop had the remotest idea whose glasses they were. So Walsh pieces can still be found for almost pennies - if only I'd kept the others I've found over the years I'd now have a decent set, but have to say those I found before, together with today's, have all be clear - none of those gorgeous green, blue or red overlay colours that do exist somewhere.
Haven't attached a picture - we've had Kenilworth images before, I know.
-
The blue is also very nice ! ;D
-
Hi thanks to all for the information very interesting.
Learned a lot about an area of glass I know little about.
Carol
-
very nice Keith - please don't tell me it only cost you £1 ;D
-
Not a lot more ! :o ;D ;D