Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass Paperweights => Topic started by: bOBA on January 31, 2018, 12:18:03 PM
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Hi everyone. I recently bought these doorknobs. I have a small group of Vasart type weights, a corkscrew, gear shift knobs etc... I was hoping these may be a part of that group and I would welcome any comments regarding type and age and factory, as I am aware that there are many Vasart type weights which can be similar to some elements of Perthshire due to the canes being sometimes used at both. They came off the same door which is great, there is no number written under the footplate. Does anyone know if this is a dating point, as many are stamped. Many thanks,
Robert (bOBA)
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I can't answer your question about dating, but I am looking to purchase some Vasart gearshift knobs. I gave the last one I had to my brother thinking it would be easy to replace. He installed it in his restored vintage Morgan.
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Thanks Allan,
I will contact you via your website re. gear shift weights, hopefully I can help.
Robert (bOBA)
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Hi. I think these are most likely Vasart. Certainly not Perthshire.
Alan
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Thanks Alan, I am pleased about that. I did wonder if the centre cane in one of them may have been a deliberate butterfly. As soon as I saw it, it leapt to mind. It seems to be inside a prominent centre cane for one of them. This may just be a coincidence. Still, they are really lovely things.
Robert (bOBA)
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Hi Robert,
For interest ...
The cane that has what looks like a possible butterfly centre is simply a distortion of a six-lobed "flower" pattern. I have the same cane within my own collection of Vasart / Strathearn weights, and it has slightly less distortion in one of the lobes.
I can confirm that the cane was in fact made at least as early as the Ysart Brothers (Vasart) period 1946-1955/6. Also I have a very close match to the canes in the inner row of the same doorknob. And the other two canes are also of a typical style of the Ysart Brothers period but I do not have an exact match for those.
Again, the the canes in the other doorknob follow the style from the Ysart Brothers period, but I do not have exact or close matches for those and they could just as easily have been made in the 1956 - 1964 Vasart Ltd period.
If you have, or can get, access to, a shortwave uv lamp it would be good to know how the clear glass fluoresces. If it is blue, then it is Vasart Ltd, 1956 onwards, or even Strathearn. If it is a shade of grey (definitely not blue) then it is Ysart Brothers period (or earlier) and would be, for me, the first confirmed case of a doorknob from those earlier years.
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;D I can't add any actual information, but they both just scream "Vasart" at me.
It's the pale colours, and the sorts of combinations of them. :)
I'm not going by any more than that. ;)
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Thanks Kevin and Sue for your comments. I am pleased that the knobs may be later Vasart. I am surprised that Vasart would have used a damaged flower cane as a centrally important decorative cane for the paperweight but maybe it folded in the making. I have thrown a UV torch over this and my other possible Vasart/Perthshire paperweights and I am not really sure I can tell anything regarding blue colours, or steel, some are purple..... Thanks very much for the comments as I think these are attractive items and my knowledge in this area is pretty limited. I feel I know a little more.
Robert (bOBA)
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Vasart really struggled to get hold of any coloured enamels whatsoever - their production got all caught up in the war and the essential austerity imposed then.
They could not really afford to "lose" any touches of colour at all, so canes such as that would still be used. :)
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HI Robert
Just to echo what Sue has said - Vasart were in dire straits both financially and with difficulty in sourcing colour. I have spoken at length about Vasart with Dave Moir who was an apprentice there from 1954.
Even then, 9 years after the end of the war he said what colour they could get came from Blythe Colour Works and Plowden and Thompson. The distinctive orange they used was made from Vitrolite tiles that was ground up in a corn crusher. by the apprentices. The same method was used to make the cullet. The corn crusher had exposed steel cogs and Dave said the dust was terrible - very little health and safety in those days!
The paperweights were made entirely at the furnace as there was no glory hole so all the reheating had to be done at the mouth of the furnace and this accounts for the raised millefiori canes that are typical of Vasart paperwieghts. There wasn't enough heat at the mouth of the furnace to get the gather hot enough to be able to press the pickup flush with the ground.
The paperweights were annealed in a kiln that was heated by coke. Dave said there was no thermostat and the temperature in the kiln depended on the quality of the coke. The only way they could check the temperature was by gently sticking an arm in the kiln!!
Best regards
Derek
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Thanks both. I appreciate the insight. I am trying to look into which book best explains the Vasart years generally pre the emergence of Perthshire. Any ideas are welcome. The Perthshire weights are beautifully made but the charm of Vasart, based partly on these primitive techniques is tangible, even with odd mistakes thrown in. Personally I liked the raised canes and still do after knowing they are partly like that due to necessity. I have studied and written about early Beranek so I have seen a little of glass made under less than ideal circumstances... Thank you for mentioning the orange, I am amused to hear about the warm orange colour that is in Vasart weights, it is in the first Vasart type weight I bought, that must have been a very noisy machine indeed!
thanks again,
Robert (bOBA)
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Hi Robert
There are two main books dealing with Vasart - John Simmonds - "Paperweights from Great Britain" and Bob Hall - "Scottish paperweights"
unfortunately both the books were based on 1980's research and contain some important inaccuracies.
A better bet would be to secure copies of the 2011 and 2012 PCA Bulletin where I traced the history of Scottish paperweights from the
1920's when theYsart family arrived at Moncrieff' through to the current day and corrects the inaccuracies in the books previously mentioned.
Then in the 2014 PCA bulletin I contributed a related article laying out the latest research about the Ysart family.
More recently there is also Angela Bowey's book "Pirelli Glass" published in 2016 which contains some useful info about Vasart and their
link with George Dunlop although the bulk of the book is about the Prielli Glass animals.
Hope this helps
Best regards
Derek
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Thank you Derek for those useful pointers, I will be looking into these areas,
Robert (bOBA)
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Great References - Thanks Derek. The Vasart / Pirelli / Lassman connection is also explored in the 2015 PCA Bulletin article that Angela Bowey and I wrote "Pirelli, Vasart, and the Ysart Family". In particular we add information on the Lassman / Vasart barware line and the effort that went into providing an anchor for the mechanical attachment of the hardware in corkscrews, bottle openers, etc.
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In Reply #7, Robert said:
I have thrown a UV torch over this and my other possible Vasart/Perthshire paperweights and I am not really sure I can tell anything regarding blue colours, or steel, some are purple.....
Standard UV lights (strip, torch, lamp etc.) are in the longwave band. They will not show fluorescence differences between 1st period Vasart, 2nd period Vasart and Strathearn - all of which will show a shade of green, some a bit brighter than others and some more yellow than others, but all green.
A shortwave uv light will show blue flouresecnce for the lead-based glass used for the 2nd period Vasart (glass batch changed during 1956) and Strathearn items. The 1st period Vasart items will show as a shade of grey under the shortwave light.
The uv fluorescence thingy is perhaps a bit of a personal issue with me and is not so important for most folk. But I would dearly like to see, or just know of, a Vasart doorknob, bar-set item etc, that fluoresces as grey rather than blue under shortwave uv. I believe they exist, but so far I have not seen or heard of one.
It's getting to be like missing out on a "simple tick" for my bird watching lists! ;D
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Kevin, what wave length are you recommending for short UV? 265 nm or something different? I've always put off getting the short UV due to the danger to the eyes and the cost. Any recommendations?
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My uv lamp is a mains powered handheld unit with 8w lights ... longwave (365 nm) and shortwave (254 nm). I bought it many years ago from the "UVP California" company (they now have agents in many parts of the world including the UK). The main advantage of this type of lamp is that the uv reaction can be seen very well without having to hold the lamp 2 inches from the item being checked. But it wasn't cheap!
These days, there are several units for battery operated shortwave or longwave (or dual) lamps. They can be found on eBay ... but beware ... lamps through eBay (and other similar sources) will vary in quality of build and effectiveness of use. And they very likely will not come with any warnings about using protective goggles or facemasks etc.
To check out effectiveness etc., I bought a shortwave unit from Germany via eBay. It was stated as being for such as checking postage stamps - and had a product name of "Lighthouse". It was of basic plastic construction and needed four AA batteries. The small On/Off switch had no indication of "On" or "Off"! I inserted batteries and found that the light was in the "On" position. I switched it off but the lamp was still operative! I could find no way to check or tweak the inner workings of the On/Off control. I did not use it after that experience. And I have not tried any other "cheaper" battery powered units.
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Thanks ... very helpful.