Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: Jay on June 11, 2019, 07:23:31 AM
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Trying to track down an ID for this one, which was sold as being Espaivet...I have not been able to find this design in my references, so am not yet convinced!
Of course there are quite a few variations of this type from a range of factories, but also suspicious that this is an easy victim for modern pirates of such designs.
Does anybody recognise it??
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Yes, I do, Jay. ;D
I took a photo of this very vase in the museum in Wroclaw, and the caption under it. I have just checked my photographs.
The caption card reads;
Huta Neimen J. Stolle w Brzozbwce
slow-blown sodium glass
1930s
Sorry, i can't post pics just now - I changed pc and my old pics are all in wrong formats. I have them rescued from the old hard drive.
I may have mis-spelt Brzozbwce. The "bwce" bit at the end of the word is very out of focus, but I'm sure you'll know what it ought to be.
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I have more. I was given a (treasured) copy of the book on 20th century glass and ceramics from the museum. ;D
So, I've found the vase in there too. The caption with it is a little confusing, as it refers to two picture numbers, but only one image is there. I cannot type Polish accents on letters. I have coloured the letters which require accents red.
It reads:
"1360-1361. Dwa wazony, ok. 1930
Szklo sodowe, "cichodmuchane" barwione w masie, matowane; wys. 30,5; katalog firmowy, wzor 1307.
Ksztalt tulipanowaty, szyjka krotka lekko rozchylona, na calej powierzchni zeberkowanie urozmaicone czterema klinowatymi kwiatonami symetrycznie rozmieszczonymi. Kolor pierwszego niebieski, drugiego rozowy.
Nr inw. XVIII-2262; zakup 1986; nr inw.XVIII-2613;zakup 1997
bibliogr.: "Projekt" 2-3,1982,il. s. 58; Banas, "Niemen" 1984, s. 19, 104, 108.
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Thanks Sue. That's wonderful and so quick! ;-) I wish my memory worked at that speed (when it works at all!)
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I have bit of a bugbear about how unrecognised and how fabulous Polish glass is and dilgently took photographs (without flash and with permission) of everything I could in the museum, in the hope that it would become useful some day.
It's taken a few years, but here we are. It wasn't a vague memory, Jay. It was one I planted in the hope of fruition. It finally paid off today. ;D
I just hope you can read Polish.
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Well done, then. I see quite a lot of Polish glass but very little of it is recognised by dealers. If there is a way I can help to back up/store your scans then please let me know.
Google translate made a passable job of the translation with no problems. (of course you DO need a little knowledge of glass to decode it, though!) :)
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I'm a complete technosaurus and incompatible with computery stuff, but my brother might be able to help me soon. I wouldn't understand any explanations.
The book from the museum does show much better photographs than those I took and might well be a very good reference book for you to have for 20th century Polish art glass and ceramics.
It is called; "ceramika i szklo polskie XX wieku", published in 2004. There is no ISBN, it is copyrighted to the Museum itself.
The copy i was given is the one with the maroon cover. I drool over it, frequently. ;D
eta. I hadn't heard of Espaivet, Jay. Are you happy or disappointed with the correct but different attribution?
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I'm a curator, so I only care about it being correct! (If the seller is disappointed , they shouldn't be!) Of course, it's influenced by the fact that value these days is more about decorative strength than about the collectibility or history, sad to say for us 'buffs'!.
There a lot of good illustrations on this collectors site, mostly focusing on French factories doing similar styles. http://vases-art-deco.fr/espaivet.html
(SPV from Societee de Paris (Verres), I seem to recall.)
I also added some new info about similar 'Oreor' vases and lamp-bases on my own site.
http://www.hogelandshoeve.be/index433.html
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Well, I care about the accuracy too and I'm absolutely delighted to have been able to help. And to promote Polish Glass a little bit. It was Anik who gifted me the book after I'd been there. :)
Thanks for the links to educate me a bit, I will enjoy those. 8)
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We might have run into some moulds being moved inbetween companies here Jay!
I've just been looking through your first link and there are two vases there that are in my book exactly next to the image of the blue vase you have.
Photos numbers 1362 and 1633 (which are in black and white for this particular section of the book), are of "Feuillages et Baies" and "Les Nuages" by Espiavet, but come under the chapter heading of;
Huty Szklane "Niemen" (Okolice, Lidy, Obecnie Bialorus) in my book.
And I have a photo of a green "Les Nuages" beside your blue vase in the same cabinet in the museum.
I suspect we might have to do a bit more digging and date finding. ;D ;D ;D
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There may be a link to another story as well (The Catteau vase with 'Chinese roses' (http://vases-art-deco.fr/scailmont.html at the bottom) was made at Scailmont, but at some point the mould was sold/(re)moved to another factory, the Catteau signature was removed from the mould). I have been told that the mould was later returned, and inspected, and that it 'is known' where the mould was used interim...however I'm still not able to access that vital last link..where where these satine vases being produced after the original factories closed?
My guess has always been Preciosa, because I know they were completely unethical in this respect and VERY acquisitive for molds!) PLUS it kinda follows the style of Desna /Barolac / Hoffman products, but it is still only circumstantial evidence.
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There are images of 4 vases in my book, the one I have not mentioned yet, is a round shape with crysanthemums on a ribbed background. There is an amber example in the museum.
Those 4 are all there are in this "range" of satinated vases from this maker, in the museum itself and in the book from it. Although I did not see or photograph the "Les Nuages" style one which is in the book, it wasn't on display.
I've found an image of the crysanthemum one on the web, (on pinterest which I don't understand) described as;
Art Deco P de Cagny Amber Frosted Satin Glass French Chrysanthemum Vase Signed #ArtDeco #PderCagny
https://www.pinterest.fr/pin/556827941407170554/
that might be a link to it. :)
I'm only dabbling around the edges of this, Jay - I don't know nearly enough background to be able to contribute. I just felt when I was in the Museum that I really ought to get records of these particular vases and their attributions.
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There may be a link to another story as well (The Catteau vase with 'Chinese roses' (http://vases-art-deco.fr/scailmont.html at the bottom) was made at Scailmont, but at some point the mould was sold/(re)moved to another factory, the Catteau signature was removed from the mould). I have been told that the mould was later returned, and inspected, and that it 'is known' where the mould was used interim...however I'm still not able to access that vital last link..where where these satine vases being produced after the original factories closed?
My guess has always been Preciosa, because I know they were completely unethical in this respect and VERY acquisitive for molds!) PLUS it kinda follows the style of Desna /Barolac / Hoffman products, but it is still only circumstantial evidence.
I need to have a look through some books and sites because a few years ago I came across another theory, that Catteau followed an internship in white Russia and apparently came back with this design. I can't remember where I have read it but i'll try to find it back. I have the same vase, unmarked and much lighter in weight.
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The story I heard was that 'a mould was returned to Scailmont, and it was clearly visible that the signature had been removed from the mould.'
The source didn't recall any more detail, so...it provokes questions rather than answering them! :)
e,g, if the mould WAS returned to the factory, then maybe it was holidaying nearer to Belgium (than Russia or Bohemia) during the 'lost years' ??
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Just for clarification, because it confused me greatly, the Chinese Roses pattern is the same as Ondulations on the Scailmont link.
(It didn't look like roses to me and isn't called Chinese roses, I went on a wild goose chase looking for chinese roses elsewhere and found it was the same vase as Ondulations.) :)