Glass Message Board
Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => Murano & Italy Glass => Topic started by: chuggy on August 23, 2006, 07:25:17 PM
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Has anyone else noticed the number of scavo pieces that seem to be around at present. Given that these used to be scarce, I'm wondering if someone out there is now reproducing them. Anyone got ant thoughts?
Paul
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I've noticed that too...
I know that Cenedese has a production of them that are new, but there are many out there without signatures or labels that look too iffy (im guilty of buying 2 last year). At least I've seen that most of the Barbini scavo pieces out there are the real thing.
Javier
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I'm quite taken by this one but not at all certain of it's origins despite the label, but it's a big piece at 40cm high.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180021547715
Paul
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The largest Scavo producer is still LaFiore in Mallorca; they have 2 or 3 outlets on the island itself, a large one in Barajas (Madrid) Airport and assorted dealers throughout the country, especially around Roman ruins (like Merida). Their production includes "replicas" of Roman glass - except they're pretty lumpy and you would not mistake it for the real article. Of course, they're not marked...
Another source of Scavo is Israel where lightweight Roman imitations are made in considerable numbers, and it seems there is quite a large industry somewhere south of Venice which specialises in Scavo ...
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Hi Ivo!
Thanks for giving us that information....
Do you have any links or photos handy of the pieces by LaFiore and any other you know are new?
Hey Paul,
Just looked at the link for that pink Scavo piece...
It looks like an earlier Cenedese copy, but being made by Seguso Vetri? I also saw that there was a Martens Oriente copy, earlier last month I think it was, also with the Seguso Vetri label by the same seller. I dont have any references on Seguso Vetri, just here and there on catalogues, but seems very interesting.
Javier
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http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-2990
2 Lafiore Scavo pieces
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Hi,
As to the Seguso label, I have notice that a german auctionhouse recently sold many glass items of different techniques (filigrana, sommerso, scavo etc), with this label. It must be a post-70's plastic label, but as far as I know, that company ceased its production in the early 80's, so maybe there is some label around still unused,....
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Could someone please tell me the definition of scavo? I can;t find it anywhere.
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Thanks for asking that Lynne. I wanted to but have asked so many seemingly dumb questions I didn't want to ask another.
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LOL Pat, I have been gathering my courage... :lol:
but if we are to learn, we have to ask I suppose.
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The process where corrosive chemical material is added to the surface of hot glass to give a matt finish. The final piece has a rough or "excavated" look.
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I do have another reason for asking, yesterday I bought a lot of latticino/zanfirico (take your pick - I still don't know when to call it one or t'other!) and a small flask, that I was going to ask about here in any case.
Here are the pics:
first three latticino pieces (http://www.clarkagency.co.uk/latticino%20one.jpg)
other latticino, filigrana jug and poss. scavo flask (http://www.clarkagency.co.uk/latticino%20two.jpg)
scavo on its own
(http://www.clarkagency.co.uk/scavo.jpg)
Is this what you mean by scavo? Is it one of your fakes do you think?
I'd be interested in any views on the other pieces too, I think I might have paid too much for them :cry:
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Lynne the finger bowl and under plate are either Venini or Salviati what are the bases like. The scavo piece could be Cenedese, but with the multitude of other options I'm now far from certain. The interesting piece is the little filegrana joy as unusual with an applied clear handle like that whats the base of that like?
A nice mixed batch though.
Paul
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Paul, they are still wrapped up, these are the quick and dirty pics from the auction view - I'll get them unwrapped and photo'd for you with bases etc. before I list them.
Interesting that you say that the bowl and plate go together - do you think they will be more commercial offered together rather than separately?
I like the little jug as well! Very pretty.
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If they are Venini which with the gold thread running through the zanfirico cane is quite likely then I would definitely keep them together as most get split up and for a collector it's a pain pairing them back up again.
Paul
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Remember the yellow decanter I posted?
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,5144.0.html
Does this have a Scavo effect, or was I right in assuming Corroso?
I also have a tall Cenedese (labelled) bud vase with this type of effect. I'll post it later for comparison.
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Lynn, I have no idea what on earth you have bought, but the stripped ones (especially green) are soooooo pretty! Lucky you :!: :oops: (okay, now imagine green instead of red :) )
Carolyn
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...Does this have a Scavo effect, or was I right in assuming Corroso?
I also have a tall Cenedese (labelled) bud vase with this type of effect. I'll post it later for comparison.
Looks like a type of Corroso finish, not Scavo.
Javier
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scavo on its own
(http://www.clarkagency.co.uk/scavo.jpg)
Is this what you mean by scavo? Is it one of your fakes do you think?
Hi Lynne,
That one doesn't look like a Scavo piece to me. Too much of it is clean, with an iridescent surface. I'll post some of the ones I have in my collection, and I'll post the 1 I think its a newer piece too.
Javier
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I would never attribute those filigranas to Venini, but that's just me. Salviati and Fratelli Toso are both strong possibilities.
The ruby colored pitcher looks like an iridized piece to me. I don't see anything "scavo" about it. However, it's hard to see in the photo exactly what's going on with the finish. It's a lovely piece, but I'm not sure it's Italian. I'd be interested in seeing more photos.
The little signed decanter is not Scavo. It seems to be what's called "frosted" glass. Scavo is a very rough finish - so rough that you could light a match on it.
Javier is right that there are tons of new scavos out there. I'm not sure most of them are Italian. Cenedese still makes them, but they are signed. As Ivo pointed out, there are lots of replicas of Roman glass that have a Scavo finish.
The early Alfredo Barbini for Cenedese scavos tend to have lots of different (but muted) colors applied to the glass. Their forms are decidely primative, without ornamentation. They are also quite heavy. If the piece offered by the German seller didn't have that curious Seguso sticker, I would have thought it an early Cenedese vase. That such a good reproduction exists worries me more than the cheap Scavos offered all over ebay.
Laura
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Thanks Javier and Laura - I'll take some photos over the weekend and get them up so we can see what we have here.
The little jug was in a lot of Murano, but it was just catalogued as Latticino and other glass, so that is not a lot of help :cry:
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I would never attribute those filigranas to Venini, but that's just me. Salviati and Fratelli Toso are both strong possibilities.
I agree with that. They look like older Salviati or Toso pieces to me than anything Venini.
The ruby colored pitcher looks like an iridized piece to me. I don't see anything "scavo" about it. However, it's hard to see in the photo exactly what's going on with the finish. It's a lovely piece, but I'm not sure it's Italian. I'd be interested in seeing more photos.
It looks like the glass around the middle is bubbling up? Maybe you can post this vase in the Main Glass board when you get some new photos. I think its very interesting. It might be a Spanish piece too. The way the neck and mouth of the vase are made does make me think its an older piece.
Javier is right that there are tons of new scavos out there. I'm not sure most of them are Italian. Cenedese still makes them, but they are signed. As Ivo pointed out, there are lots of replicas of Roman glass that have a Scavo finish.
I have seen a ton of the little scavo vases with twisted handles around the necks on Ebay lately, well thats not true, since I've been on Ebay! Some are described as Roman glass, and others as Murano. One of the reasons im not touching those anymore. I did buy 1 very large blue vase, that I thought was an older Scavo piece, but the more time passes, I think I bought a new vase. I still need to post a pic of it. I bought it because of the color, it was blue, and has applied white handles that looked old (from the small pictures).
... If the piece offered by the German seller didn't have that curious Seguso sticker, I would have thought it an early Cenedese vase. That such a good reproduction exists worries me more than the cheap Scavos offered all over ebay.
I know, my first thought too. I have a few book which do show older Cenedese Scavo pieces and it looks like something early, but seeing how it had a Seguso label, a new one at that, and how it looked like an older piece, made me wonder if they werent just appliying the labels repros. I'd really like to see if the Seguso Vetri book is coming out soon, to see if any of these styles are really being made by Seguso or what.
Javier
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Here is my first posting ever on this board, to which nobody ever replied(!)
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,3901.0.html
Since the topic of scavo is under consideration... It was purchased early in my collecting, and based on the nature of these discussions my hopes are dim.
Thanks,
Charles.
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Here's a Roman glass repro being sold as Cenedese:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Murano-Vintage-Cenedese-irideshent-glass-vase_W0QQitemZ160022379666
ebay item 160022379666
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Thanks Laura. That phony baloney eBay listing (from Italy, no less!) answers my questions about my piece. Buyers beware! Seems the only way to avoid getting ripped off these days with scavo, pulegoso or the like is to study collectors guides (discounting the attribtuions by 50%) and then seek out real pieces from antique shows or auction previews. Once there, pick up and hold as many as you dare. The little purple edged "pulegoso" bowl (pictured below) looked like a masterpiece in the thrift store, but once home after comparing it to my Seguso pulegoso bowls, I concluded that the $2.00 I paid was about double its value.
Charles.
(http://i4.tinypic.com/25ppfte.jpg)
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Here are a few vintage Scavo pieces from my collection.
Cenedese Signed and Labeled
(http://www.svazzo.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/.pond/scavoblue.jpg.w300h225.jpg)
Signed Barbini for Oggetti
(http://www.svazzo.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/.pond/scavocolors.jpg.w300h225.jpg)
Signed Barbini Object
(http://www.svazzo.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/.pond/scavobject.jpg.w300h225.jpg)
(http://www.svazzo.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/.pond/scavobject2.jpg.w300h225.jpg)
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Ok act got together. Here are the pics of the Latticino bowl and plate, the filigrana juglet, and the iridized ewer. I look forward to your varying views :lol:
White filigrana jug (http://www.clarkagency.co.uk/white%20filigrana.htm)
iridized red ewer (http://www.clarkagency.co.uk/red%20ewer.htm)
Latticino bowl and plate (http://www.clarkagency.co.uk/latticino%20bowl.htm)
The white filigrana jug and the bowl/plate are very light and delicate, much lighter than the other latticino pieces in the original auction pics, which have much thicker rims.
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I know I'm in a minority and Laura and Javier don't agree, but I'm pretty certain the finger bowl and under plate are Venini. These were NEVER marked and when in Italy a few years back I saw a whole table layout in this work which had been commisioned from Venini. If you look at the bottom of the bowl the way it is finished is completely different to the bottom of Salviati pieces, so until someone conclusively proves otherwise to me I'm digging my heels in on this one.
Paul
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Hi Paul,
Please dont take it as ganging up on you.
If you saw these as Venini we take your word for it.
Maybe we can start a new topic on the Salviati/Toso pieces and Venini ones, with samples of the bottoms on them so we can see the difference.
Javier
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Chuggy, I'm not ganging up on you at all. In fact, there's only me and the cat here, and he's too sleepy to gang up on anything. :P
Did you see these at Venini? Where the ones you saw labeled or signed?
The type of filigranas shown here are common - I mean, variations are at every antique show I go to. I've seen them with labels other than Venini, and have never seen anything remotely like them in any of the Venini literature.
I certainly believe that someone could commission Venini to do filigranas. However, I cannot believe that all these filigranas, of which there are doznes on ebay at any one time, could be wrongly attributed in all the literature for so long.
See my point?
Laura