Glass Message Board
Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => British & Irish Glass => Topic started by: thewingedsphinx on April 15, 2022, 04:31:28 PM
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Found a nice little lead Crystal glass recently, I recognised the pattern from Neil’s website and he has kindly authorised the use of the illustration it looks a match for unregistered Molineaux and Webb 113, it’s quite small , i was expecting a goblet, probably one of the earliest pieces of identified pressed glass I have. Cheers Mike
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Lovely piece.
I was curious about the design differences between the actual and the pattern design - both in the proportions and the stem (having studiously tried to match my green becher shape :) )
Does it look quite similar to this one in the Launay Hautin catalogue 1841 no 2707 (see Seite 5 von 21 on the Pressglas-Korrespondenz link)?
Certainly the stem looks more similar to the Launay Hautin version than the Molineax Webb version I think although the proportionately larger rim is curious?
https://www.pressglas-korrespondenz.de/aktuelles/pdf/pk-2016-2w-peltonen-pokal-russland-1841-1917.pdf
Further down on Seite 14 von 21 you can see the goblet appears in the 2nd partie of the catalogue on page 90 -
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Ooerrr thanks “flying free” for sharing that, it definitely has similarities with the St Louis liqueur especially the stem, I also think some of the illustrations from that era maybe open to interpretation, but those catalogues do show a great resemblance. Perhaps even older than I thought. I think Neil may have found similarities between these makers before including Boston and Sandwich, Cheers Mike
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Yes these panelled goblets, or a liqueur in this case, I believe are design classics which were made in the USA, UK and Europe by a variety of makers. You see the patterns in the majority of surviving catalogues from the Victorian era.
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I think the stem similarity between the St Louis pattern and the liqueur glass is stark though. It's not the same stem as the one on the MW pattern. The MW pattern stem is one I see most frequently which made the stem on the liqueur catch my eye.
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There is a Percival Vickers version of this one where the stem is much closer to the blue one shown. Alas the catalogue image is rather degraded.
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Hi Neil, do you have any other examples of this colour from Manchester manufacturers?
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Not really. There is one tumbler in this colour which matches a Percival Vickers pattern, but it's one of these panel types again which could have been made anywhere. Manchester blues tend to be darker or a light opaque blue.
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Not to put a spanner in the works but this is an interesting footed goblet in red which Siegmar suggest could have been made in Czechoslovakia after 1945. It's the same pattern as a goblet in the Launay Hautin 1840s catalogue. However I don't know if the underside of the foot i.e. the base, is patterned the same as the LH catalogue version as it's not shown:
https://pressglas-korrespondenz.de/aktuelles/pdf/pk-2005-4w-sg-reproduktionen-engl.pdf
I'm just adding this because the glass colour could be important in identifying your liqueur eventually.
In my view your liqueur more closely matches the shape of the liqueur from Saint-Louis in the Launay Hautin catalogue. The base of the foot also matches the LH catalogue. And it also seems, from my reading of Neil's comments, that it might not be a Manchester colour glass.
So I would be looking to see if Saint-Louis produced this blue colour glass in the 1840s, which is perhaps along the same lines as your thoughts given your question on colour :)
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Further to my comments in the last post there is this blue from Baccarat shown in the Launay Hautin catalogue 1840. It seems slightly different to your liqueur ... however it's Baccarat not Cristallerie Saint-Louis, but it demonstrates they were producing a bright blue transparent glass around that time :) :
https://pressglas-pavillon.de/misc/08296.html
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A further addition to my two posts above ;D
There is a blue footed goblet here where the owner says it appears to be like the one in the Launay Hautin catalogue for St. Louis :
see no 5.062.1 (you need to scroll down)
http://www.pressglas.de/Pressglas_1840-1940/Sammlung/Becher_Einfuehrung/B/Fussbecher_2/fussbecher_2.html
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Thanks for spending the time on this and sharing the links, for what it’s worth it does have a very slight reaction to a uv light so I do think it’s older than new. I’ve seen those early blue salts before.
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Bonjour, more blue glass with a similar foot and colouer.
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thewinged did you think you'd posted an accompanying picture? I can't see any photo attached to your post above :)
m
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Oops, sacre bluer
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144546049596?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=X17_h6GvTkW&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=h76BUnvMS6e&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=MORE