Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: Pinkspoons on January 31, 2007, 01:21:45 PM
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I'd like to include a section on the Holmegaard reference site I'm busy furrowing away on which covers glass mistakenly (or, more often than not, fraudulently) attributed to the glassworks by dealers, in the hope that it will help collectors become a little more savvy in their purchases. It would be nice to identify a few of the more common faux-megaards, for the purpose of the site.
Does anybody recognise any of these?
Red baluster vase (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HOLMEGAARD-PALETTE-RED-WHITE-LINED-VASE_W0QQitemZ200072387247QQihZ010QQcategoryZ29563QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) - these pop up in Germany quite often.
JE Bang "Style" Vase (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VINTAGE-HOLMEGAARD-SCANDINAVIAN-GULL-PURPLE-VASE_W0QQitemZ200073238982QQihZ010QQcategoryZ29563QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem). Warning, this auction contains the words 'Gull' and 'Equisite' - so I'm sure many of you know which seller it is before you click. *shudders* But these vases pop up frequently in antiques centres as Holmegaard/Kastrup.
Blue Baluster Vase (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Holmegaard-workshop-Kastrup-designed-by-Otto-Brauer_W0QQitemZ180079536478QQihZ008QQcategoryZ29563QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)
Modern Green Vase (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Stunning-Holmegaard-Cased-Art-Glass-Retro-Vase_W0QQitemZ110084063971QQihZ001QQcategoryZ29563QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) - smells like Poland or China.
The 'Gull' Vase (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/RETRO-VIVID-ORANGE-GULL-VASE-BY-HOLMEGAARD-wow-groovy_W0QQitemZ140077816939QQihZ004QQcategoryZ123450QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) spreads to other sellers... *shudders*
This is just from one quick sweep of eBay, but they're generally the most common ones. It's sad how many of them fetch higher prices than genuine Holmegaard - especially when it comes to very modern, very cheap cased glass in 'retro' patterns that regularly fetch £40-£60 (or even more - I've seen them go off at £150+ before) under the guise of Holmegaard.
Does anybody have any photographs of any of the above pieces they'd be willing to donate to the project? You'd receive full credit on the site, of course. The plea also applies to any vaguely Holmegaard-ish pieces that aren't Holmegaard.
Also, does anybody have any further additions to the above list?
I'm hoping this qualifies as a main board topic, rather than Cafe chatter, as it should bring up a few helpful bits.
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While I can't help very such, I would definitely consider this a main Glass topic and I wish you good luck with this project!
Please provide a URL as and when something is ready :)
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Thanks, David.
It shouldn't be *too* long before it's up and ready, as it will only be a basic slip of a thing... my web-making skills (beyond those of tossing together html mock-ups for cleverer folk than I to turn into real sites) are next-to-useless!
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Nic, I thought I had a photo of something like Palette in my pics...I found it, knew it was Ivo's pic but couldn't find anything about Portieux (as I'd labelled it) on the net that was in this style. Searched GMB and found the thread:
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,2865.msg21900.html#msg21900
You've probably made a note already...just realised you comment on that thread too...duh to me.
(PS: Kind of neat, as I say in that thread that I'll save the photo to a folder - and I did...lol)
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I've got it saved and tucked away too! ;D
I've got hundreds of now seemingly quite random photos I've saved from various sources since I started to take a real interest in Holmegaard... which was probably around the time that Portieux post hails from (I'm still a newbie at this!). It's a shame that I can't really use most of them online - due to copyright issues - but they're still useful for my own reference.
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My guesses- and I stresses guesses!
1. Taube
2. Empoli
3. Elme
4. China
5. Empoli
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Starters for ten ;D
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/colouredglass005.jpg
Left to right: Italian, Empoli (?), Chinese (?)
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/colouredglass004.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/colouredglass003.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/italian002.jpg
Italian - Empoli
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/orangeandblue.jpg
Far right - Chinese
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/miscel-6.jpg Whitefriars
Quite a few Chinese I think.
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My guesses- and I stresses guesses!
1. Taube
2. Empoli
3. Elme
4. China
5. Empoli
I had considered Elme for #3, but all of the bits and bobs of cased Elme I own have fire-polished rims. The photographs on the auction make that one look ground and polished.
#2 - Empoli is an interesting one - I was suspecting Polish. The vases seem to show up regularly on eBay UK (and at UK car boots), but not really anywhere else... as far as I've noticed.
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Starters for ten ;D
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/colouredglass005.jpg
Left to right: Italian, Empoli (?), Chinese (?)
Thanks for those, Anne. I think there are several of the one on the right currently up for sale as Holmegaard as we speak...!
Spotted one here: Auction (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Holmegaard-1960s-Scandinavian-Green-Cased-Glass-Vase_W0QQitemZ120079606508QQihZ002QQcategoryZ29563QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem)
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What a great idea Nic - well done. If you check in my 'other Italian' glass section I've got a yellow one like the green one above and a bright orange cased vase and I've got an orange Elme in the Scandi glass section that you correctly identified for me - you're welcome those pictures if you want them - just let me know.
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Thanks, Pip - but it's just an idea liberally 'borrowed' from Whitefriars.com. Although mine won't be interactive.
Have already got the Elme covered from my own stockpile: Photo (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b108/pinkspoons/1-7.jpg), but I may snaffle the other one. I'll drop you a line first when the time comes to sorting them. :)
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Here's one that I have, Nic........... made by Hirschberg, Germany (labelled).
(http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/albums/userpics/10026/thumb_hirschberg.jpg) (http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4805)
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Mine just has a 'Foreign' foil label on its bum, which wasn't too uncommon with Swedish glass for export. Ivo suggested Elme for it a while back.
The similarities are striking, though. ???
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Here's one that I often see on ebay identified as Holmegaard
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/albums/userpics/10011/Picture_694.jpg
I think it's Italian.
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It shouldn't be *too* long before it's up and ready, as it will only be a basic slip of a thing...
Now where have I heard that before...? ;D
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Nic,
Quite a while ago, there was a thread about some Holmegaard look-a-like glasses labelled Målerås:
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,3836.0.html (http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,3836.0.html)
The original auction photos have gone but if you would like a piccy, I've a couple of the what I *think* are the Målerås look-a-likes I can dig out.
Robbo
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That would be fantastic, if you could. I've been kicking myself for ages for not saving the photos from that auction! Thanks!
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This one's a real is it is or is it ain't?
Gulvase (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=014&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=330082150715&rd=1&rd=1)
It's an ain't, I'd say, though. The colour's ALL wrong, and the white isn't white enough. But the form is spot-on. Scarily lots of direct copies with just slightly-off colours fell out of Italy.
So I'll also be hoping to catalogue as many of the genuine HG colours as possible with pictoral examples, as they can play such an important role buying a vase worth £100-200 and buying one worth £10-20.
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gosh - I'd no idea there were copycat gulvases. The colour, although unusual, wouldn't alert me to this not being 'right' - I don't know the full range of colours unfortunately and I think I'd be more likely to assume it was a dodgy picture rather than a weird colour. However, I think the rim might trigger something - it's just too narrow, the proportions aren't quite right there - the flat rim on my gulvase is like a dinner plate (Ok I'm exaggerating but you get my point). What do you think of the rim on that one Nic?
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I thought it was a bit squiffy to start with, but I dragged out a couple of mine with labels and I have one that's not quite so flat with narrower proportions too.
H'm... I don't know now that I've had time to pnder it - it may very well be just a duff photograph with washed-out colours. But they're selling another Gulvase and the colour looks fairly spot-on with that one.
There are so many copies out there that I'd avoid any variation on eBay like the plague - even at the risk of missing out on a prototype/one-off piece. With the uncased Gulvase it's even harder to tell the fakes from the originals, even with handling them yourself. I once had one in jet black (well, very VERY dark purple), and I was convinced it was a super-rare real thing until I found a stall with two on at a nearby antique fair! ;D
I think there was another on eBay recently - I'll see if I can find the auction.
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Nic - I would be suspicious of that pale blue aqua one. It is very similar color to the vases that Target had in their store last year.
Target vases (http://www.target.com/gp/browse.html/ref=in_se_pagelist/602-2100495-0512654?ie=UTF8&size=75&rank=salesrank&node=12850101&field-browse=12850101&page=1&index=target)
I looked briefly but it is too early (before 5 am) for me to concentrate.
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I have two of these bottle vases one blue and the other orange complete with the ball tops.
Compared with the original Holmegaard gul vases they are poor quality i.e. white casing, colour and the lip is narrow.
Italian copies in my opinion.
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There is some room for variation in the Gulvase rim - I've got two early cased ones in this size (one is white/white and the other is yellow/yellow - both with original labels), and their rims are both different sizes. The yellow/yellow one is pretty close to the odd baby-blue one in this auction and the white one is broader and very flat.
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I contacted the seller, and he confirmed that it is a very pale baby blue with a muddied white interior - so it's fairly certainly a knock-off, I'd say.
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This one's a real is it is or is it ain't?
I've seen these being sold on the web but they are new. I have a feeling they were from Italy or Poland (???) - I'll see if I can find my jottings. The lip is not quite perpendicular, unlike the originals, and the white interior is much thicker at the rim edge too if I remember right.
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Another one often sold as Holmegaard.
This was moved on on a buy it now as Holmegaard at £39.99 though the seller new it was not.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=110052217226
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Hi Nic, thought you might like this on eBay 170073861403 ??? also look at their other one 170073849235
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Thanks.
Another "gull" vase. Grr. I think these ones were produced in Italy too - I've seen them in cased glass. Although Holmegaard did actually produce a Gulvase-ish shape like this, with a shanked stopper, in cased glass - but they're fairly rare and the rims are quite different.
The second one is Bo Borgstrom for Aseda, I would say (not really my field, though), although Holmegaard did churn out some vases with these kinds of colours and utilising the more bland of Aseda-esque shapes in the 'Harlekin' series by Anja Kjær in 1994.
PS: Could a moderator please move these two posts to the Holmegaard Mistaken Identity thread on the main board? TIA.
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Japan? Wow, I really would have guessed at Italian for it.
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It was the colour or should i say colours of the second one i was wondering about? did the base look slightly green to you? it could just be the way thi photo was taken, reflection from the screen, but if not, two tone?
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Yes, the base is green. Casing dark colours in lighter coloured glass is a fairly typical Bo Borgstrom design motif.
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I've got one of those, or one very similar, the rim wasn't finished properly either.
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-260
I'm getting the general feeling that anything with a white interior is Holmegaard, but of course it isn't. ::)
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Saying that I've done it myself, but without the evil of selling something for what it's not. :'(
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Another one often sold as Holmegaard.
This was moved on on a buy it now as Holmegaard at £39.99 though the seller new it was not.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=110052217226
Norleans is a U.S. importer name, I believe. You can find porcelain pieces also with the Norleans sticker and Japan.
I think someone here posted the history of the company a few months back.
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Another one that is often listed as Holmegaard, but is actually Åseda, Bo Borgström:
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-229 (http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-229)
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Here are the Målerås (possibly) glasses:
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4957 (http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4957)
They're the greenish ones on the left. I'm unsure about the pair on the right (Nic, could these be Holmegaard Copenhagen?)
More of the Målerås:
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4956 (http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4956)
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4958 (http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4958)
Robbo
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Could someone confirm that the glasses robbo posted are Målerås, or at least definitely not HG? If so, I can sneak a link into this thread (http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,3836.0.html), because the eBay pics have disappeared.
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Cathy,
I have the original photos from the auction in the other thread (obviously I can't post them due to copyright). Mine are a size smaller, 70mm high, but the shape and colour *look* the same. I say *look* because without seeing them side by side with the auctioned ones, it's difficult to reach a conclusion. The rim finish is very like the HG Canada glasses I've had. The set in the auction were all labelled.
Robbo
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It shouldn't be *too* long before it's up and ready, as it will only be a basic slip of a thing...
Now where have I heard that before...? ;D
which bit though David? the basic slip of a thing, or the not *too*long bit?? ;D ;D
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I am reading through all this with great interest, thank you everyone, although how on earth I will retain all this information is another thing. It is incredible how many variations on a theme there are.
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I'm unsure about the pair on the right (Nic, could these be Holmegaard Copenhagen?)
Sorry for the delay in replying - have been away.
They look more like a range called Skotland - I've a boxed set winging its way from the USA as we speak, so hopefully I can verify within a few days.
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This one annoyed me. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130076257846
describing it as HOLMEGAARD SCANDINAVIAN ERA (how does a region have an era?), and failing to mention in the listing that the label (clearly visible in the picture) said Ingrid Glass. >:(
Unusual piece though............looks as though a kid got hold of it with a few pots of paint!
Cat
Great idea for a thread Nic, but it's going to get very long...........would it be possible to collect the pictures into an album on the glass galleries to be viewed en mass?
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When the thread's all done and dusted, I'll be gathering up any donated pictures and will organise them tidily in a Holmegaard Mistaken Identity gallery on my forthcoming Holmegaard resource website. ;D
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Here's a good site for seeing Holmegaard and other Scandinavian glass.
It's an internet auction site, all items go through a brick and mortar house for valuation and identification.
They're pretty good with Holmegaard and Swedish glass as auction houses are in Denmark, Sweden, Norway and Germany/Austria. They started out in Denmark. Their identifications of Murano pieces sometimes leaves something to be desired, as well as paperweights. Holmegaard, Kosta etc they know pretty well.
Being in Norway shipping and custom costs are prohibitive for bidding on the non-Norwegian stuff,
but a man can look and dream ; )
Auction Site (http://www.lauritz.com/ItemList/ItemList.aspx?LanguageId=2&DC=1&CPIn=0&ISz=s&PSz=s&PSzG=s&SO=3&ST=0&ArId=s&IgId=36&TTyp=0&TVal=0&FLId=2&FCId=6&FText=&LLan=s)
Alexander
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I've put in a few bids for large joblots of Holmegaard on Lauritz in the past, but the various fees and shipping costs do become very prohibitive.
They've brought down the costs of international purchases recently, though - before there used to be a £50 flat shipping/handling fee for all purchases sent by standard Post Denmark! :o
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So what does Holmegaard have about naming their lines after countries. Canada, Skotland, what's next? ??? :)
Carolyn
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Don't forget the Greenland series. :D
And then there are ranges named after specific places within countries - of these there are many, from cities (Havana, for example) to street names (Carnaby).
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Don't forget the Greenland series. :D
And then there are ranges named after specific places within countries - of these there are many, from cities (Havana, for example) to street names (Carnaby).
What do they do? Spin the globe and throw darts? ;D
Carolyn
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Interesting 'gulvase style' piece shown here as possibly 'vintage Italian.
http://www.modcats.com/item.php?item=696&from=glass-european.php
;)
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Green is a known colour for Gulvases, but I agree that it's an Italian vase.
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The gull thing...
I took another look at the first "gull" vase in this thread - the one with a bird decoration.
The Norwegian artisan collective Plus Fredrikstad produced decanters and vases with a gull, as in seagull, type decoration.
The color of the mentioned piece doesn't ring a bell. They did pieces in similar shapes.
The seagull is very similar to a piece I have. Most of my colletion is in chaos at the moment
as I had to move it for some electrical work on the house so it took a while to check.
Seagull Decorated Small Decanter (http://www.wilhelmsen.no/glass/plus.decanter.jpg)
All Plus glass, with the exeption of som popular ashtrays, was signed in some way.
Their glass is quite popular here commanding good prices, some of norway's finest
glass artists put in time there at one time or another. All designs were approved by an artists comittee.
The Holmegaard "gulvase" name while similar to "gull" means something completely different.
If a scandinavian (norwegian, swedish or danish) uses the word "gull" that means gold, "gul" means yellow and
"gulv" means floor.
What the "gul" in "gulvase" means I'm not to clear on but it could be wordplay on "gulv vase"
which would be "floor vase".
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The decoration on the purple vase in the auction is more of a palm motif than an avian design - the auction just shows the vase poorly (probably on purpose). The seller is only throwing 'gull' in there because they're dishonestly trying to pass it off as a Gulvase to amateur collectors, but are too ignorant to get it right. I've seen these vases up close in junk shops, and they're really nasty, badly made things.
I do like the colour of your decanter, though - I've always been a sucker for more subtle palettes.