Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: MoMac on February 06, 2007, 05:29:52 PM
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BEAUTIFUL VICTORIAN GLASS VASE BY JOHN WALSH WALSH OF BIRMINGHAM, ENGLAND
My daughter owns a very attractive collectable Victorian Glass Vase is by John Walsh Walsh of Birmingham, England. It is part of their "Autumnal ware" range and would have been made in the late 19th Century. My daughter is wishing to sell the vase, but unfortunately as we are not glass collectors we have no idea of the value and would appreciate some help.
I would describe this vase as egg shaped, has a beautiful rose pink colour on the inside, overlayed with white glass on the outside.
A fluted leaf design in pink and green is applied around the outer body, the vase stands on three applied feet which are pale yellow in colour, this same colour is also used
in the decoration around the top rim.
There is a Pontil mark underneath and this has a flower design impressed into it.
The vase stands approx 19cm tall (7.5inch), approximately 43cm (16.9 inches) in diameter and is in excellent undamaged condition with no chips, marks or cracks.
If you feel you can help with the valuation I can email pictures. I do need this information fairly urgently as my daughter wishes to place this up for sale asap.
I'm in the process of trying to attach pictures but with some difficulty, if you would like to email me I'll forward some pictures to you in the meantime. Many thanks
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We don't do valuations and this would not be an easy item to find on eBay, the best on-line valuation service, that we usually recommend.
Do post a notice about the auction in our marketplace section as many interested parties could read about it there.
Pictures are a great help, please see our guide here http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,6522.0.html
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Does anyone know how where I can find how much the John Walsh Walsh vase is worth please.
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Hi MoMac :) Please feel free to upload your photo's to our Yobunny gallery, Frank gave you the link in the thread above. Perhaps you might get some more information on your vase that would be helpful to you?
You could try the big auction houses with your daughters vase, I think they will accept photo's by post or maybe email if you can't get to them easily yourself.
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The other opton is to scour the internet for online sellers with something similar, but if you find anything they are likely to be top end prices
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Here is the link for pictures of the vase.
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4912
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Thank you for your photo's. :) It might take a little while for someone to post any other information for you as people here have different fields of expertise and aren't always available immediately.
In the meantime, you could contact Simon Cottle at Sothebys. His email address can be found on the Sothebys website, listed under Specialist Departments > ceramics & glass > London > Olympia. He can take a little while to get back to you, but you could follow up with a phone call perhaps?
Best of luck with your item! :)
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My earlier remark that finding an example would be less than easy seem to have been premature:
Watch this http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200075169055
Yours would likely sell for less than this one as the top bidder will have been satisfied.
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I find this interesting as I have always liked the opal-over-pink items with applied acanthus leaves. Perhaps not a partucularly masculine design, but I think it is one that typifies the late Victorian tastes.
What I have never found out, however, is which companies actually made which items - there seems to be various attributions given in books and by dealers. Is there any defeinte evidence that this vase is by Walsh Walsh?
In Victorian Decorative Glass, British Designs, 1850-1914 by Mervyn Gulliver, several examples with the coloured acanthus leaves are shown (pages 128/9) but sadly no attribuions are given. However, for three of them the text states, "... illustrated in an advertisement for Autumnal Ware, included in the Pottery Gazette, on May 1, 1884, by the dealers Blumberg & Company of Cannon Street London."
In Decorative Victorian Glass by Cyril Manley (pages 68/9), this style of vase has various comments and the reader is left with a puzzle about attributions, but possibilities include Stevens & Williams.
Gulliver does, however, give general price guides for each item shown and for these vases he suggested £175 to £195. In the author's words, " ... all prices quoted ... are approximate and are based on 2001, United Kingdom values for items in good condition." I suspect those prices are what would be charged by a knowledgeable dealer. Actual pirces obtained on resale can vary considerably.
Edited to add:I have just seen Frank's entry showing the eBay link ... which is, I believe, for the vase we are considering. It will be interesting to see what the outcome is. But I would still like to know whether Walsh Walsh can be confirmed as the maker.
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Yes, that is true the eBay one mentions no mark so I would not be too sure it is a safe bid without more data.
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According to Skelcher, The Big Book of Vaseline Glass, page 102, "the acanthus leaf with bent stem forming a foot appears a number of times in the Stevens & Williams pattern books of the 1880s. Prunt in a pontil mark [pic shown is like yours] is typical of other Stevens & Williams prunts." He also shows a vase similar to yours. The white part of your vase should glow a very bright green under a UV light - perhaps you know a friendly shopkeeper - which indicates that it is uranium glass. I would go with Stevens & Williams rather than Walsh Walsh but... I covet it
I would guess that you would be unlikely to get more than the price of the item Frank found on ebay. Only MHO though. Scarce or hard to find might be better than rare!
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I would also go with S&W, though that lip decoration may place it elswhere. I also ID it as the same vase at ebay.
S&W produced a lot of Applique Art Glass.
It was therefore decided, in the first place, that their regular type of applied glassware, the decorations being chiefly acanthaus leaves in various shapes and colours on glass bowls and vases should continue. These pieces were first-class and popular, which is apparent by the number still available. R S Williams-Thomas ~The Crystal Years~
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My earlier remark that finding an example would be less than easy seem to have been premature:
Watch this http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200075169055
Yours would likely sell for less than this one as the top bidder will have been satisfied.
Frank, if you compare the wording of this item to the description by Momac, it would seem to be exactly the same piece, so perhaps he/she decided to go ahead with a listing?
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It would appear that my daughter has already listed the vase on ebay without knowing its value. In which case I would be concerned as to whether she will acquire the true value of the vase especially noticing that there are currently no live bids on it. I would be extremely worried that someone may step in at the last and purchase the vase below its worth. I also wonder now in view of the fact that some members have expressed the view that the vase may not be a John Walsh Walsh, has now thrown us in to deep confusion. We queried the maker of this vase a few months previous with a web site named Great-Glass.co.uk who advised us that it was a John Walsh Walsh but would not give a valuation on it for us. Therefore we were at a loss as to the value of this piece. After being given the advice from Great Glass we subsequently noticed that they had a picture of an identical vase in their photo gallery which was listed as a John Walsh Walsh Vase. I then contacted them again and they advised me that they had sold this item but again would not give any indication of its value. See item No. 6140 at www.great-glass.co.uk/library/lib2ac.htm
I have since noticed recently that a fancy John Walsh Walsh Vase was sold on ebay in the USA for around £300. In view of the forgoing we feel that maybe I should speak with my daughter with a view to pulling the vase off ebay until we have made further investigations although we do seem to be hitting if not a brick wall certainly a very confusing one.
If any of your members are able to offer any advice at all this would be greatly appreciated. May I express my gratitude for the interest they have so far displayed.
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An item is only worth what anyone will pay for it. I sincerely doubt that your daughter's vase is worth £300, particulary as ebay has made access to Victorian glass so much easier and the higher prices are usually attained by the more complex designs with fruit, flowers and leaves. I also doubt that the Walsh, Walsh or Stevens and Williams issue can be resolved.
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Prices for Victorian glass, particularly with embellishments can vary wildly, as can prices for Walsh Walsh depending on the style. Ebay is low at the moment with glass prices.
The last piece of Walsh Walsh I sold reached £35. I recently sold a piece of Kralik with applied flowers and leaves, identical to a piece in Great-Glass for £10. A nicer piece of vaseline Kralik with applied flowers failed to sell at a low price of £30.
I hope this helps. You may need to search through ebay to see what similar pieces have achieved.
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There is also Boulton & Mills as a possibility.
We have had this discussion several times on the board before.
Here is one discussion
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,7619.0.html
I also made an album in the glass gallery with my pieces. Be back with that link.
Edited:
Another discussion
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,1594.0.html
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MoMac — Knowledge of applied acanthus leaf Victorian fancies has progressed since the discussions referenced by Connie immediately above. The definitive work is now Victorian Decorative Glass by Mervyn Gulliver, which illustrates examples from some five or six different glass houses, mostly unidentified. Since Gulliver was published in 2002, new information has come to light that shows that an Autumnal Ware range sold by the wholesaler Blumberg & Co. of London, and illustrated in their trade advertisement published in 1884, was, in fact, made by John Walsh Walsh. Autumnal Ware was Walsh's name for the range.
You daughter's vase happens to be a close match to one of those featured in Blumberg's advertisement, so it was made by John Walsh Walsh.
I hope that helps.
Bernard C. 8)
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What about the use of the curled stems for the feet though? Skelcher indicates catagorically that these have been seen in S&W catalogues. Did Walsh Walsh also use such feet? He is also quite careful with his attributions and often only only says probably or possibly