Topic: Murano? Two vases, blue /white glass, abstract flowers

[e39dinan]

Please help identify these vases! Hi, My wife and I bought these about 10 years ago from a reputable art dealer in La Jolla, CA. They don't have any documentation or signatures, however there is a sticker on each one. There are a few bubbles within the glass, and the surface isn't perfectly smooth on either. Would someone please help to identify them?

Thanks!





http://i.imgur.com/yB1CSHJ.jpg[/img]

[Paul S.]

hello, welcome to the GMB

In the Glass Gallery section of this forum, we have an archive devoted to marks and labels for glass from around the world, and for which there are over 100 different labels for glass originating from Murano alone.
Just had a look and can confirm that your label..........  gold oval with red writing 'MADE IN ITALY - Murano - VENEZIA' is included amongst these, although there isn't any accompanying specific information beyond that.
Labels with simply some form of generic 'Murano' wording are prolific, and won't, on their own, tell you the actual maker.

Date wise I would suggest this label is from some time in the 1960 - 1970 period, although unfortunately, the presence of a label isn't evidence of authenticity of origin from a given factory, and it might be more reliable to revisit your dealer and ask them to help.

Sorry this lacks the sort of conclusion your really need.

[e39dinan]

Hi Paul,

Thanks for your analysis, much appreciated.

Any idea what to value them at without documentation?

edit: Also, do you know of a way to have them authenticated?

Regards

hello, welcome to the GMB

In the Glass Gallery section of this forum, we have an archive devoted to marks and labels for glass from around the world, and for which there are over 100 different labels for glass originating from Murano alone.
Just had a look and can confirm that your label..........  gold oval with red writing 'MADE IN ITALY - Murano - VENEZIA' is included amongst these, although there isn't any accompanying specific information beyond that.
Labels with simply some form of generic 'Murano' wording are prolific, and won't, on their own, tell you the actual maker.

Date wise I would suggest this label is from some time in the 1960 - 1970 period, although unfortunately, the presence of a label isn't evidence of authenticity of origin from a given factory, and it might be more reliable to revisit your dealer and ask them to help.

Sorry this lacks the sort of conclusion your really need.

[Paul S.]

hi   -  contrary to what people often assume, there is a policy on the GMB of not discussing values.      This may appear unhelpful, but as you will appreciate such matters can be massively subjective, and as the saying goes 'one man's meat is another man's poison'.       As individuals, how we value pieces differs enormously, and experience has taught that it's better to refrain entirely to avoid disputes, so sorry to be negative but regret this is a no go area here.
Glass from the Gulf of Venice is not my area, so regret cannot personally offer advice as to maker, and the lack of replies from others may be indicative of problems with recognizing your pieces as originating from Murano, despite the labels.

Might suggest that you contact professional sources of art glass in California, sending photos etc., requesting help with attribution/provenance - although appreciate such assistance might incur some cost.
Alternatively, auction houses might be prepared to help with information, but again their advice may not come free of charge.
Searching the internet and past auction sales is a possible way of locating similar pieces, and might also provide some guide to value.

Wish you luck with your search and would again suggest the option of returning to your dealer in La Jolla, and requesting help, assuming they are trading still. 

[glassobsessed]

There is absolutely no policy about discussing values on this forum. On the other hand the convention is that we tend not to for the reasons that Paul mentions, any given valuation is fraught with variables.

Your vases were made in Italy as the labels state, they were not made on Murano, if they had been the label would read Made in Murano. Several manufacturers or distributors use this sharp practice to fool buyers into believing they are buying wares made on the island of Murano when they are not. Any value is likely to be decorative only.

John

[Ohio]

Well I am not certain I agree that these vases could not have been made in Murano although granted Italian glass is something I only dabble in from time to time. When looking at the Murano, Venezia portion of the label I came up with Pauly & C. – Compagnia Venezia Murano, a company that has been around for close to a century that makes art glass although granted the label does not say specifically Pauly & C. – Compagnia Venezia Murano. Murano islands are after all in italy. Does anyone have any legitimate documentation that states a label must state Made in Murano for a piece to have been made in Murano & if so when was this enacted? I did find on the site below numerous labels that stated Made In Italy with Murano on a separate line. Even AVEM used this type of label. Is this site incorrect in their title Murano Labels 101?
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/thumbnails.php?album=102

I did find info on a consortium regarding labels by law do have standards for saying what constitutes genuine Murano glass, but no date as to when this was enacted. I am curious because I am wondering if this is a relatively speaking "recent" within the past (give or take a few years) decade policy in light of the Chinese glass debacle with Murano labels being placed on the Chinese glass in Venice warehouses.

I find no solid information that states labels in past decades must carry any specific Made In Murano specifications for the glass to be genuine Murano uless when I looked through a couple more Murano label sites. Italy (yes) Murano (yes) specifically Made In Murano (no).

Not trying to cause any controversy, buy exactly how does one tell which labels are legit & which labels not through past decades? I think its a legitimate question that just because a label possibly decades old does not carry "Made In" specification, but does carry "Italy" & "Murano" specifications preclude pieces that carry "italy & Murano" without the "Made In"  not being genuine Murano.

[Alsretro]

I think an example of this label is already in the labels gallery but here is the base of a vase of mine that doesn't specifically say Made in Murano rather it says Made in Italy. I am confident this was made in/ on Murano the clue being in the maker's name although maybe I'm mistaken
Alastair

[Ohio]

Precisely my point, you cannot read in or not read in where manufactured with these labels in some cases. For instance your label on the two vases says Venezia...well Venezia can be stated as referring to Venice or Venezia as in the heart of Murano Island itself & further your label on two vases does state Murano.

[e39dinan]

Hello,

Thank you all for your valuable feedback & finding the label in the registry. It is much appreciated. Would anyone be so kind as to suggest an asking price?

Thanks

[Paul S.]

  I could be wrong, but probably not - too much potential for disagreements is the likely reason, as already discussed.         Might suggest that you consider the figure you purchased at, then factor in some allowance for inflation, and err on the high side to start with, allowing you to consider some margin for counter offers or discount.

Obviously, we wish you luck