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Author Topic: Walther Prismen Uranium Glass Trinket Set with Original Labels  (Read 2033 times)

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Offline Jayne

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Way back in 2011, a few months after joining this forum, I came across a trinket set on eBay with original "AWS (August Walther & Sohne) Dresden Glass Foreign" labels attached.

Sadly the set was already sold, but I managed to obtain permission from the seller "Riverbride" aka John to share the photos and info as I believe did Anne at the time. However it seems we both omitted to share this info, so here it is finally.
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Offline Jayne

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Re: Walther Prismen Uranium Glass Trinket Set with Original Labels
« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2020, 07:39:41 PM »
More photos of the labelled Walther Prismen set and details from the listing with measurements, condtion etc.
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Offline NevB

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Re: Walther Prismen Uranium Glass Trinket Set with Original Labels
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2020, 10:03:32 AM »
This set raises a few anomalies. The tray design and pot sizes don't match the catalogue images on GTS (not unusual), so is it maybe a later version? I've got a clear green version of this which I thought was Libochovice 1700 as seen in the photos on GTS but having checked, the detailing on the pot lids and the tops of the candlesticks is different. I seem to remember there has been some discussion on this before on GMB. The Walther labels also raise questions.
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Offline NevB

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Re: Walther Prismen Uranium Glass Trinket Set with Original Labels
« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2020, 10:18:24 AM »
Unfortunately if the Walther labels are correct most of the Libochovice 1700 photos on GTS, apart from maybe the ring holders, are also Walther Prismen.
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Offline Jayne

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Re: Walther Prismen Uranium Glass Trinket Set with Original Labels
« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2020, 11:27:52 AM »
Hi NevB, yes I realise this is a controversial subject, there have been many discussions comparing Walther Prismen and Libochovice 1700 Trinket Sets over the past 9 years since I've been here at least, and likely before that as well. However, I do think these pictures are worthy of sharing and discussing. As you quite rightly say, catalogue images are not always accurate and often serve more as a guide rather than certainty.

I have a few reasons to think this style may well be the genuine Walther Prismen set and not Libochovice 1700 and some comparisons to add, since I have been collecting these for 10 years and have quite a few of them and also some sets/pieces which could be the Lib 1700 set.

First, the quality of the glass seems typically Walther, the satinised versions are especially smooth just like the mermaid set.

Second, the amount of frosted/satinised sets in this style seems huge compared to transparent colours, and Libochovice trinket sets seem to almost always be in transparent colours, I know some Lib 3020 sets are partially frosted, but that seems the exception.

Third, the Walther Prismen rectangular tray comes in sets with the exact same pots, ring holder, and more often than not candlesticks as this oval tray set, sometimes the sticks are a variant also seen with some oval tray sets.

Fourth, I have finally aquired what I believe to be an original Walther Prismen Tray as seen in the catalogue image, and due to the sharpness and roughness of the saw edge, I believe this could be a good reason for AWS Walther to have changed the original design to something more practical and tactile, I will share a pic of this and items in the other points above in due course.

Of course I could be completely wrong on all points. :)
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Offline Jayne

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Walther Prismen Rectangular Tray Trinket Sets 1931 1933 Catalogues
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2020, 02:03:41 AM »
Some examples to show here of Walther Prismen Trinket Sets with Rectangular Trays in various colours. The tray is shown in the 1931 and 1933 catalogues.

I have shown them in the original second hand form I purchased in, not adding any extras to try and complete the sets, for the purpose of trying to establish which pots, candlesticks and ring holders are Walther Prismen and which are Libochovice 1700. Of course the sets could have still been purchased as a marriage but we can consider averages and likelihoods.

1931 Catalogue https://www.glas-musterbuch.de/Walther-1931.116+B6YmFja1BJRD0xMTYmcHJvZHVjdElEPTUxODMmcGlkX3Byb2R1Y3Q9MTE2JmRldGFpbD0_.0.html

1933 Catalogue https://www.glas-musterbuch.de/Walther-1933.34+B6YmFja1BJRD0zNCZwcm9kdWN0SUQ9MTM0MSZwaWRfcHJvZHVjdD0zNCZkZXRhaWw9.0.html
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Offline NevB

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Re: Walther Prismen Rectangular Tray Trinket Sets 1931 1933 Catalogues
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2020, 10:19:22 AM »
The trays all look to be the early Prismen pattern, the pots and ring holders might be a later version, the candlesticks don't look right as they appear to be tapered not straight like Prismen and L1700, although the base decoration looks right. Looking at the 1933 catalogue I think the design would soon have been considered "old fashioned" and been updated but it's odd that the only mention of the Prismen pattern in the 1937 catalogue is the 8-sided tray.
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Offline Jayne

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Walther Prismen Original Oval Tray and Comparisons
« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2020, 08:27:47 PM »
I believe this is an original Walther Prismen Oval Tray as shown in the 1931 and 1933 catalogues.

https://www.glas-musterbuch.de/Walther-1931.116+B6YmFja1BJRD0xMTYmcHJvZHVjdElEPTUxNTImcGlkX3Byb2R1Y3Q9MTE2JmRldGFpbD0_.0.html

https://www.glas-musterbuch.de/Walther-1933.34+B6YmFja1BJRD0zNCZwcm9kdWN0SUQ9MTM2NCZwaWRfcHJvZHVjdD0zNCZkZXRhaWw9.0.html

I posted a thread recently showing "AWS (August Walther & Sohne) Dresden Glass Foreign" labels on a Green Uranium Walther Prismen trinket set, and will add comparison photos of the same tray from that set in clear and also a possible Libochovice 1700 Tray contender in my second post here.

https://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,69719.0.html

As previously mentioned, due to the roughness and sharpness of the saw edge of the original Walther Prismen Tray, it seems possible the design was changed to something more practical and tactile for the dressing table where hands would be moving back and forth over the tray on a regular basis.
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Offline Jayne

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Re: Walther Prismen Original Oval Tray and Comparisons
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2020, 08:33:23 PM »
Here are comparisons of the original Walther Prismen tray, a clear version of the labelled Walther Prismen tray and a possible contender for a Libochovice 1700 tray. The sizes are all almost exactly the same, any notable size difference in the photos is just due to the angle the photo was taken from, and position of the trays on the table.
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Offline Jayne

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Re: Walther Prismen Rectangular Tray Trinket Sets 1931 1933 Catalogues
« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2020, 01:26:51 AM »
The trays all look to be the early Prismen pattern, the pots and ring holders might be a later version, the candlesticks don't look right as they appear to be tapered not straight like Prismen and L1700, although the base decoration looks right. Looking at the 1933 catalogue I think the design would soon have been considered "old fashioned" and been updated but it's odd that the only mention of the Prismen pattern in the 1937 catalogue is the 8-sided tray.

Hi NevB, actually this excercise has pointed out the tendency for that type of candlestick to be with this tray set, especially in clear colours which is interesting, in fact I don't recall seeing that type of candlestick in satin/frosted. It's worth noting the base pattern of that particular candlestick appears to match the base pattern of the pots, a slightly floral double sunburst style. (I'm sure there are better ways of describing it).

From past members posts, it seems catalogues don't always feature every single piece for sale just a selection, although your point regarding the 1937 catalogue is noted.
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