No-one likes general adverts, and ours hadn't been updated for ages, so we're having a clear-out and a change round to make the new ones useful to you. These new adverts bring in a small amount to help pay for the board and keep it free for you to use, so please do use them whenever you can, Let our links help you find great books on glass or a new piece for your collection. Thank you for supporting the Board.

Author Topic: How many moulds where used in victorian pressed glass.  (Read 965 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline traditionaljazz

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 50
How many moulds where used in victorian pressed glass.
« on: June 22, 2009, 05:32:54 PM »
Dear Everyone at the Glass Message Board, How many moulds where used in victorian pressed glass. For pressing one single item. Did they have one mould with lets say Hobnail Pattern for a compote or did they have several moulds for the Hobnail Pattern compote. Regards Traditional Jazz. P.S One Four part mould making the Hobnail Compote or several Four part moulds making the Hobnail Compote.

Support the Glass Message Board by finding a book via book-seek.com


Offline Lustrousstone

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 13645
  • Gender: Female
    • Warrington, UK
    • My Gallery
Re: How many moulds where used in victorian pressed glass.
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2009, 06:11:10 PM »
How long is a piece of string? Would depend on the size of the factory, whether the process was automated or not, whether they had spares and the expected output. Moulds were also retooled to effect repairs, change things that didn't work, put marks in or remove them, or even to make them so they used less glass (see here http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,26878.0.html). They were also replaced when repair was no longer possible

Support the Glass Message Board by finding glass through glass-seek.com


Offline mrvaselineglass

  • Author
  • Members
  • ***
  • Posts: 515
    • http://www.vaselineglass.org
Re: How many moulds where used in victorian pressed glass.
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2009, 01:34:37 AM »
Another consideration is the shape.  For example, a berry set or a water set.  6 tumblers or 6 small berry bowls, vs one water pitcher or one master berry bowl.  The output of the set of 6 would have to be 6 times greater than the master bowl.  I know of some who have compared various discrepancies between molds on small items like tumblers or berry bowls, which would mean more than one mold was involved.  There have also been authors who have speculated that a piece had to be a reproduction because the mold was different than another known example.  Just because one piece does not match another piece exactly does not mean one is a reproduction and the other is not...it could just be a second mold.  No idea on how many molds were used for specific shapes.  Every factory had their own methods and depending on the size of the glass factory, it most likely involved multiple molds for the same shape.

Support the Glass Message Board by finding a book via book-seek.com


Offline Fuhrman Glass

  • Glass Professional
  • Members
  • ***
  • Posts: 330
Re: How many moulds where used in victorian pressed glass.
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2009, 02:01:26 AM »
a lot of it depended upon whether it was run on a side lever press or a rotary press. rotary presses definitely required multiple molds.
Some items required that they use 2 or sometimes 3 molds to make the piece. It was pressed into a smooth shape and then tranferred to another mold and then the pattern was pressed into it. Sometimes they used this method for blowing items as well.
I've owned multiple molds for different objects, sometimes as many as 6-8 molds for the same item.

Support the Glass Message Board by finding glass through glass-seek.com


Offline jsmeasell

  • Author
  • Members
  • ***
  • Posts: 247
Re: How many moulds where used in victorian pressed glass.
« Reply #4 on: June 23, 2009, 02:41:16 PM »
I can tell you about moulds and pressing at Fenton Art Glass today, and I’m generally familiar with historical materials relating to glass pressing in the USA back to the 1840s. The question relating to moulds used to make Victorian-era pressed glass items is best approached by considering what is known in the glass industry as a “joint mould” (there are other kinds--such as block moulds and shell moulds--but let’s save those for another time). These joint moulds were used on side-lever presses, and the typical procedure would be that only one mould was used; for some pressed items (generally smaller articles) there might be two moulds. A rotary press here at Fenton uses four moulds. We do not have any automatic pressing machinery, but I have heard of such machines that have as many as 28 moulds and produce about 14,000 tumblers per hour when all is going well.

A joint mould for pressing glass has these parts: plunger; mould (typically 2, 3 or 4 parts depending upon the size and shape of the piece and the depth of the pattern); two handles; bottom plate; ring with handle; and key with handle. The key and the ring have to be removed after each pressing operation so than the mould can be opened and the object can be taken out. If anyone needs further clarification of these parts, let me know in this forum. In the meantime, examine some of your pressed glass items and see how many joint marks various items have.

Joint moulds are typically used on a hand-operated side-lever press. The lever is always on the right, so this is a right-handed operation, and a weighted counterbalance makes the job of the presser just a bit easier. At the start of production, the mould is placed on the flat table of the side-lever press, and the mould will slide on the lubricated surface of the table to be properly positioned directly under the plunger. Moulds are quite heavy, and the presser and a helper (called turning out worker) standing to his left work together to move the mould as needed. We have side-lever presses still in operation that are many years old, and none of them has a table that would accommodate more than two moulds. In looking through materials (1890 to present) relating to union-management agreements regarding pressing, I see references to production using two moulds on a side-lever press but I’ve never seen a mention of three or more moulds on a side-lever press. A rotary press (there is a US Patent for such in 1876) typically has four moulds (but just one plunger).

Lastly, I cannot envisage a pressing operation where the piece is somehow pressed more than once. The object cannot be removed from the mould until it has cooled (workers say the glass has “set up”) sufficiently so that it will not deform (called “run down”). You might reheat the piece in a glory hole to do something like crimping or otherwise changing the shape, but I have never heard of making a pressed item smooth and then pressing again to impart pattern.     

James Measell, Historian
Fenton Art Glass Co.

Support the Glass Message Board by finding a book via book-seek.com


Offline Frank

  • Author
  • Members
  • ***
  • Posts: 9508
  • Gender: Male
    • Glass history
    • Europe
    • Gateway
Re: How many moulds where used in victorian pressed glass.
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2009, 02:57:00 PM »
An old brochure for bottle making machines LINK (Since that has been on-line I have had two enquiries for purchasing the machines and one looking for spare parts :huh: )

and an account of a side lever glassware presser LINK

Support the Glass Message Board by finding glass through glass-seek.com


Offline traditionaljazz

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 50
Re: How many moulds where used in victorian pressed glass.
« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2009, 10:57:39 PM »
An old brochure for bottle making machines LINK (Since that has been on-line I have had two enquiries for purchasing the machines and one looking for spare parts :huh: )

and an account of a side lever glassware presser LINK
Dear Everyone at the Glass Message Board, Thank you for your replies and comments on this subject. I am sorry if that i have not replied soonest. Regards TraditionalJazz

Support the Glass Message Board by finding a book via book-seek.com


 

SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk
Visit the Glass Encyclopedia
link to glass encyclopedia
Visit the Online Glass Museum
link to glass museum


This website is provided by Angela Bowey, PO Box 113, Paihia 0247, New Zealand