Topic: Large cloudy bubbly swirly vase - Nazeing? ID = S&W/Royal Brierley

[flying free]

Very pretty Paul!
With regards the range 'Rainbow' I think Nigel was just pointing out that they are the same shapes as the Rainbow range, not that these are called Rainbow.
I think the pink ones are 'cloudy and probably  your green ones fall under that as well maybe? but they looks to be slightly different  in that it is bubbles but not cloud and doesn't have white in it.  It also looks slightly different in the way the colour is laid on but I'm probably wrong 
Perhaps S&W did a 'cloudy' and a 'bubbly' range?
Also are they S&W or Royal Brierley? 
m

[Paul S.]

you're quite correct, I should read more carefully........."the same shapes as the Rainbow Ware range by S&W".           Regret that I know almost nothing more about these pieces  -  they now fall outside of my interest area - they are left-overs from when I did collect this sort of material - sorry.

[nigel benson]

Hello again,

Paul, I'm a tad surprised that you didn't show pictures of the bases, in particular the way the pontils have been finished.................

Amazing how rare it is to find labels on any of these S&W/RB pieces as a way of pinning down the correct term. As so often, I'm afraid the only true way to find out is to research within the original archive  However, I have to ask whether it matters too much since S&W was the owner of the RB name; indeed when you find a piece of marked Keith Murray glass both names are used!

Nigel

[flying free]

thanks Nigel
So is it correct to refer to them as Stevens and Williams, but not necessarily Royal Brierley unless they were produced after they changed the name?
m

[nigel benson]

m,

From memory, I seem to recall that S&W changed their trade name after a Royal visit in 1932 (?), so does that not complicate things as far as the discussion in hand goes? Or, you could say it makes it easier??

Currently, there is not always a definitive answer I'm afraid.

Nigel

[Paul S.]

quote from Nigel......................"I'm a tad surprised that you didn't show pictures of the bases, in particular the way the pontils have been finished".................                   
I was going to Nigel, but at the last minute changed my mind partly as my sampling was very small, and partly because at the time I thought it more useful to show several pix of the bubbles and halos.
However, I will post some relevant pix later today, and people can then make up their own minds as to whether my comments were valid.
Perhaps someone else might do the same, and we'll have a comparison of 'bottoms'

[flying free]

  thanks Nigel.  I knew it was some date that would mean it wasn't possible to really be sure about this range.  Well,not unless we know what year it was produced and have the pattern books.  No mention in 20th Century British Glass C Hajdemach - no mention in the STevens and Williams book (that seems to have a different start date for Caerleon btw - 1919 apparently first produced at  their Lighting Glass Factory at Tipton - from the that in 20th Century British Glass C Hajdemach where it says that the first appearance in the pattern books of these was on 1 January 1929)
It does say make a comment in CH 20th Century British Glass though, page 110 under the Caerleon plate quote"Variations such as blue were introduced early in 1930 but after then no new Caerleon patterns appear in the pattern books and the emphasis moved to the stylish cut designs on black and green cased glass echoing the geometric Art Deco fashions)".
So is it  possible the cloudy streaky range was produced prior to 1930?
m

[keith]

Have one similar in green that I presumed to be S&W's

[Paul S.]

that does look a likely candidate for SW/RB Keith, although would have been good to see a clear bright pic of the pontil area as well.

Now attaching some pix of ground/polished pontil depressions, hoping that they show what I personally think of as typical characteristics of the individual factories.           The green ones are SW/RB and the dull pink example is Nazeing.

I notice that my one and only piece of SW 'Alabaster' also has a large well polished pontil depression  -  perhaps more confirmation that the bottoms of Nazeing were not as well finished as SW.           But, as I say, to feel sure that such a comment was valid then a large number of examples should be looked at.

[flying free]

all my Stevens and Williams pieces have had very large polished pontil marks if that helps regardless of range/design
m