Topic: Chinese Pate-de-Verre - Liuligongfang

[Greg.]

Hi,

Picked this up today out and about on a bit of a whim.  Seen a handful of other threads discussing Liuligongfang and their Pate-de-Verre production on this board.

Signed to the base 'Liuli 2010 987/3278'

Had a look through their website, although couldn't see anything matching this particular design, perhaps their ranges have changed this year.

Not my normal area, but seems very good quality, few pictures attached.

Any thoughts appreciated.

Thanks
Greg

[Ivo]

Any thoughts appreciated.

super piece, easily identified. One of my top contenders for collectibles of the future.

[Greg.]

Thanks Ivo, good to hear your thoughts. Just reading some of the other threads regarding Liuligongfang, would this piece be pate-de-cristal or pate-de-verre, the distinctions sounded a little technical...?

Greg
 

[pamela]

I do adore their work and this is a really nice one! 2010 was year of the Tiger 

Most designs have their special meaning and symbolism.

As far as I know 'lost wax' technique and therefore all one-of-a-kind.

Unfortunately very expensive also in Hongkong and Mainland  :cry:

[flying free]

I just refreshed my memory to check as I thought these were issued as limited editions,  albeit using the lost wax technique, and therefore not totally unique pieces.  I'm open to correction here, but I believe the moulds are created using the lost wax technique however each design is issued as a limited edition and the pieces within that edition numbered to show this.  Your piece is number 987 out of 3278 of that design.
 Obviously I guess therefore it makes each piece unique but not each design...if that makes sense?  As I said, I'm open to correction  :sun:  Is this the way Daum also produce their pieces? and would  they therefore (Liuligonfang and Daum) be considered unique anyway?
Oh and by the way, I'm very jealous    I've yet to come across a piece although desperately seeking one, and I failed to bid on the last one I saw  :cry:
m

[Max]

Might be hard to tell whether it's pate de crystal or verre without the documentation.  One piece of mine is pate de crystal, the other pate de verre. 

[Greg.]

Hi,

Makes complete sense, number 987 out of a series of 3278, produced from moulds using the lost wax technique. Looking at their website, each piece takes in total around 6-8 weeks to complete, over 12 different stages, outlined in their link below....

http://www.liuli.com/en-us/pata_de_verre.aspx

Whilst each piece has its own characteristics, essentially the series design is the same. Not completely sure about Daum's production, however, I know one of the previous threads discussing Liuligongfang touched on the fact that their technique was the same as in use at Daum these days, not really sure how unique this specific method is generally speaking, although clearly very labour intensive.

To be honest, I didn't recognise the maker initially, more the technique that stood out, came across it in a general bric-a-brac place, which is a little odd in itself seeing as it was produced only last year.
 

[Greg.]

Thanks Max, I had been wondering, I sent their customer services department a brief email, so am hoping that they might shed a little more light.

[Frank]

Lost wax casting has been mostly used for casting bronzes as one offs. But the technology has been refined adding another stage to make a mould from with further wax forms can be produced. With bronze casting the usually hand made wax original is buried in casting sand and the metal poured in which vaporises the wax. Unfortunately if you try that with glass you end up with very bubbly glass... so for glass you use the wax 'master' to make a mould to produce wax masters. Each wax master is then buried in a form of plaster and once set then heated to remove all of the wax... then the glass is poured into the mould. A lot of processes but not as labour intensive as you might think as each stage apart from creating the original is quite quick. It is an effective method of producing limited editions.

Technology has moved on and it possible to generate the original using computers and 3D printers so the same approach can be used for mass production and is in the container industry except that they create metal moulds from the originals. In theory is is possible to produce pate-de-vere in a 3D printer subject to glass inks (i.e. very fine glass in a suspension) that could then be fused in an oven. Slumping is prevented by also printing the mould in a non-glass material that is easily separted from the glass after fusing. No idea if anyone is doing this yet but it is a technique that offers even more remarkable art potential than is currently achieved by water cutting of glass blocks, Essentially anything you can visualise and generate as a 3D computer model could be made in glass. Exciting times....

[Frank]

I am intrigued that much of the 'Studio' and factory Pate de verre is of a very primitive nature compared to Argy-Rosseau and Liuligongfang. It is simply a matter of technique I guess and the more primitive approach tends to, in my opinion, lose out on the qualities that glass offers and tends to be no different in end result to similar techniques used in ceramics. It does not take much more effort to do as AR and L so I presume that this ceramic style is being exploited by the artists deliberately. In the case of Caithness Glass examples it is probably just to speed up production time. But heck I am a known reactionary and beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Liuligongfang I agree with Ivo is future SUPER, outbidding on any example that pops up on crimebay is good for your pension fund, buying new will work for that too.

On page 13 of Reflections 3 you can see the process of creating Pate de Verre in step by step detail  LINK