Topic: Was the Bagley Ilkley trinket set reproduced in Denmark in the 1960's?

[Jayne]

I noticed this Ebay listing some time ago, (4th May 2012)

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250898624005&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:GB:1123

and messaged the seller that I believed it was Bagley "Ilkley" not including the perfume bottle.

https://www.glasstrinketsets.com/cms3/english/bagley/ilkley-1233

The seller responded that this set was also produced in Denmark in the 1960's, and that is why it's seen with additional items.

I've now noticed some trinket pots for sale with the same seller, much discussed on this board as possible Libochovice 1700 or Walther Prismen, also listed as Danish,

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3-VINTAGE-DANISH-RETRO-JEWELLERY-GREEN-GLASS-TRINKET-JARS-1960-CIRCA-/250894402912?pt=UK_Collectables_Fragrances_EH&hash=item3a6a78c560

Lastly the Brockwitz items discussed in September 2011 here

http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,43097.msg240132.html#msg240132

are still for sale as Danish.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DANISH-VINTAGE-ART-DECO-DRESSING-TABLE-JEWELLERY-SET-/390348021476?pt=UK_Art_Glass&hash=item5ae28e1ee4 Mod: Link dead

Does anyone have any thoughts?

[Lustrousstone]

Nothing polite. Knottingley was primarily a bottle works, so there is no reason why Ilkley for the Danish market couldn't have had a perfume bottle. They bought it in Denmark, ergo it's Danish

[Paul S.]

I rather like the almost poetic description of........'Danish Dusty Green'.          Jayne - you should have asked the seller to clarify which Danish factory  -  or why they considered it was made in that country  -  however, doubtless water off a duck's back I expect.

[Anne]

I wonder if Angela Bowey has come across the blue flask before? I've dropped her a note to ask. The pattern on it seems to be a good match for the Ilkley set for sure, but there's no mention of an Ilkley flask / decanter /perfume bottle etc... in the Bagley books.

I also wonder what the source of their made in Denmark in the 1960's is? Is it something we've missed or a leap of faith? I'm agreeing with Christine, that none of these appear Danish.

Seller doesn't appear to be a member of the GMB, unless it's under a different name/email than the eBay one.

[Jayne]

Well Paul I'm no expert so I didn't want to push too much, but if anyone else wishes to then be my guest! Anne's site says Ilkley was made until the late 1950's so the 1965 date fits. I felt it best to bring to the attention of you guys who know so much more than me of these things. Hopefully Angela will be able to give Anne an answer re the Ilkley.

[Anne]

My info re dates came from Angela's Bagley book.

I emailed Ang and asked her to take a looksee at the Ilkley listing, her reply is that she's never seen the like before in connection with Ilkley. She says, "Certainly the Bagley adverts and catalogues did not include any kind of a bottle - only candlesticks in two sizes, pots with flat lids in two sizes, the tray and a ring holder. " She wondered if it could be a Davidson bottle, but again I've never seen it with any of the Davidson sets. Perhaps Chris Stewart can confirm or otherwise.

What bugs me intensely is that the colour is a good match with the rest of the set and that the bottle has lines round it like the Ilkley set does, so it looks as if it ought to match...  more digging needed!  I've emailed the seller asking if they have better pics of the bottle - that might help answer the question.

[Anne]

I've had a lovely reply back from the seller, affirming again that he believes these were copied in Denmark in the 1960s and the bottle added to the set at that time, something we aren't aware of. Does anyone know if there was there a glassworks in Denmark capable of doing this at the time?  I've no examples of trinket sets made in Denmark at all, and the only Danish glassmaker I know of is Holmegaard and if it was them then I'm sure this would be public knowledge. Who else was making pressed glass in Denmark in the 1960s?  Were the Bagley moulds sold on to another firm over there?  The seller has also promised to send me better pics of the set and the bottle after Friday this week, so I'll add more when I get those, if not before!

[Lustrousstone]

I would poke Nic, as this is not the sort of thread he would look at

[Anne]

Good thinking Christine, thanks!

Meanwhile, I've been searching for more and found one of Angela's glass newsletters from April 2005 with comments about Bagley repro's and moulds: http://www.glassnewsletter.com/050413news.html which I'll reproduce here for completeness...

Reproduction Bagley Glass
As you probably know, I have a special interest in Bagley Glass, made at The Crystal Glass Company in Knottingley, UK. Di wrote to me recently from Australia saying that in Australia "you can't turn around without tripping over a rose and leaf or equinox or the like... Bagley must have produced half the world's glass!" And the same is true of New Zealand, nearly half the glass in any second-hand shop or charity outlet that you look in turns out to be Bagley. It is so common that it surprised me to find there are companies which have reproduced Bagley glass. The equinox vase itself, which is a very common item, was reproduced by Crown Crystal Glass in Australia, and if you come across an equinox vase with stippling on alternate ribs, that is an Australian reproduction, not Bagley.

Even more fascinating are the Sarsaparilla reproductions of Bagley clocks. Both the Wyndham pattern 1333 clock and the Grantham pattern 334 clock are reproduced and offered by the USA company Sarsaparilla as "Masterpieces from the Past". I bought a Grantham one in pink glass to compare it to a Bagley one. They claim to be using original molds and making these items in the USA, and apart from the clock itself (which is round instead of square and battery instead of clockwork) they are very hard to tell apart. Fortunately the Sarsaparilla ones have the company name on the base, and mine also has the date.

You can read more about Bagley Glass in our book, available on-line at: http://www.glass-time.com/orderbagleyglassbook.html.

So, there is evidence of Bagley designs being reproduced elsewhere, so why not Denmark too? The hunt continues... 

[Pinkspoons]

Thanks for the prod, Anne. 

Kastrup and Holmegaard were certainly capable of producing these kinds of wares well into the 1970s, but whether they did or not is questionable.

None of it, at least, rings any bells from the K-HG catalogues I have, and pretty much all other glassworks had folded or been absorbed by this point. Plus I think most items of this style had been dropped by Danish manufacturers in the 1940s/50s.

Never say never, but it's very unlikely.