Topic: Josephinenhutte book with blue and white lidded goblet on the front cover

[flying free]

does anyone have the Josephinenhutte book with the blue and white lidded pokal on the front with an eagle stem?  I was just wondering what the reference was given to identify the goblet please?

I've seen that it was sold by Sotheby's in  2003 as a Russian piece with the following explanation:

'A large and rare Russian engraved blue-cased goblet and cover circa 1860
MEASUREMENTS
62cm., 24 3/8in.
DESCRIPTION
the funnel bowl finely engraved with the winged figures of Cupid and Psyche seated on a bed, a bow, quiver and lyre to one side, above a formal band of trefoils, against a matt ground, the stem formed as a carved imperial eagle, the domed foot and cover engraved with a meandering foliate branch, below a pointed leaf-capped finial
For a goblet of the same size and of similar inspiration, engraved by the same hand and bearing this distinctive eagle stem, see that sold Sotheby's London, 19th November 1996, lot 53 (£68,000). This example and the present lot are the only goblets of this extraordinary construction to come to light so far.

The design for a large (59cm. high) enamelled armorial glass with white overlay - 'ein Adlerpokal' - which includes a stem with an almost identical carved or moulded eagle, is illustrated by G.Pazaurek, Gläser der Empire- und Biedermeierzeit, p.356, pl.348 (Archiv Waldburg-Zeil). The drawing and enamel decoration on that glass is attributed to a glass enameller called Dohnt (or Dohnat) but the author is unable to provide any further details about the decorator and does not date the drawing.

Of outstanding quality, the monumental appearance might suggest that the present lot was conceived for one of the major international exhibitions of the period. There was some suggestion that the example sold by Sotheby's in 1996 had been chosen as a Czarist gift. There are strong decorative and stylistic links between the work of Franz Zach and that example- especially in the engraved vermicelli matt ground. Zach is regarded as the leading exponent of the art of engraving blue overlay. For signed examples of his work in blue overlay see the smaller goblets sold Sotheby's London, 19th December 2002, lots 40 and 50, and lot 20 for an attributed tazza.'

[flying free]

ok, I think I've found the reference here
http://www.pressglas-korrespondenz.de/aktuelles/pdf/pk-2005-2w-zelasko-schaffgotsch.pdf
Does this read that it was exhibited at the Paris 1867 World Exposition and that the reference came from the catalogue of the exposition please?

Abb. 2005-2/052
Adlerpokal für Zar Alexander II., Weltausstellung Paris 1867
H 61,2 cm, H ohne Deckel 43 cm, Kat.Nr. 253
Stefania Zelasko, Gräflich Schaffgotsch’sche Josephinenhütte, Kunstglasfabrik in Schreiberhau und Franz Pohl 1842
- 1900, Verlag Glasmuseum Passau 2005
Katalog zur Ausstellung im Glasmuseum Passau
ab Mai 2005

btw for reference it sold for £72,000 at Sotheby's in 2003
m

[Ivo]

you're getting good at this!

[flying free]

  but I still have a question
Josephinenhutte made it, so was Franz Pohl the designer, or was it him that decorated it?
I've not managed to get my head around his input having looked at various articles in German which I find hard to understand.
I was erring on the side of Franz Pohl designed it, so therefore who might the decorator be?

In this flyer I found for the Passau Museum, there are two blue cameo pieces at the bottom, one saying designed by Franz Pohl, the other saying 'Engraving Ernst Friedrich Wilhelm Simon, 1665-66' (I'm assuming the date should actually read 1865-1866, not 1600's  )
Therefore I wondered who the engraver for the £72,000 pokal is.  I can't find a reference to the engraver and it has marked similarities with Franz Zach pieces as well as a previous item that Sotheby's sold where they have noted the similarities between the two pieces.
m

[Ivo]

pohl is the decorator, the factoty-with-the-long-name is the producer.

[flying free]

thank you 
Sorry Ivo, here's the flyer I found.  At the bottom there are two very similar pieces.  Under one it says the Design Franz Pohl, and under the other it says Engraver Ernst Simon, which added to my confusion - I wasn't sure if the text related to both pieces if you see what I mean?  i.e. Pohl designed them and Simon engraved them both?
http://www.glasmuseum.de/fileadmin/Media_Glasmuseum/Aktuelles/Flyer_Band_1_Englisch_2005.pdf

[flying free]

I've amended my reply above Ivo to include some information of the flyer so you can see what I mean.
m

[Ivo]

Ach so - it is not what I read in the original link. I would think any hint to designer of the piece and engraver of the piece would be speculative.

[flying free]

 Thanks I haven't managed to find a referenced source for the decorator/engraver of the goblet and wasn't sure about the two pieces in the flyer either - it seems a bit odd that one has a designer name attached to it and the one next to it, that really does look like the same hand,  has an engravers name next to it.
That decanter in the flyer was sold through Sotheby's  in 2011 with no identification on it as far as I could find... other than Bohemian decanter.
m

[flying free]

I have found an example of the flyer written in English here
http://www.glasmuseum.de/fileadmin/Media_Glasmuseum/Aktuelles/Flyer_Band_1_Englisch_2005.pdf
btw just once again, I think there is an error in the date given on the blue over white cameo piece on the right - think it should read 1865-1866 not 1665-1666.
m