Topic: Info on registration mark please

[oldglassman]

Hi,
            Thanks for checking , as for broadening the horizon I fear that if I expand it any more I could lose site of land lol, the more I have delved into glass from the 16th 17th and 18th c the more I find there is to learn and it keeps me very busy,I do though have a liking for Webb Cameo glass lol but again no books , we just collect what we like when it comes to those.the latest 2 were captured at Cambridge.

  cheers ,
                  Peter.

[Paul S.]

wonderful pieces

[flying free]

Using this calculator and the 5 at the bottom as a 'wildcard' the information that comes up is
http://1st-glass.1st-things.com/lozengetranslator.html

'( 1 Result of a search with the MONTH as the wildcard )

Parcel Number: 4 was registered on the 15th of December 1869 by:
Lloyd & Summerfield, Birmingham.'

I don't know anything about these things but maybe that might help?

I also don't know anything about engraving, but is it an illusion or are the outlines on some of those pictures actually raised on the glass rather than engraved into the glass?
edited to add - ok maybe not.  This link seems to describe some processes and one of them is plate etched  I have no idea whether or not this was around in the late 1800's though
http://prewarglass.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/is-it-etched-cut-or-engraved-one-of.html
m

[Paul S.]

I appear not to have taken a picture of Lloyd & Summerfield Registration 237158  -  which may indicate it was something that wasn't considered to be of interest  -  as you can imagine there are many obscure items included in the sequence of Nos.              If possible will look at 237158 today.

[Paul S.]

Can say categorically that there aren't any designs (in glass) for biscuit barrels in the first volume of the National Archive Board of Trade Registrations.         This first volume, of the diamond/lozenge registrations, covers Nos. 1461 to 84598 for the period 01.09.1842 to 06.04.1852.
Etched glass during the 1840 period seems almost non-existant, and the design of this barrel appears in general more advanced when compared to other pieces in that early period.

Attached are a couple of pix showing details of - coincidentally a biscuit barrel - Registration 237158 dated 15.12.1869 for Lloyd & Sommerfield.
Whether there should be a lid I can't say.

The date of Registration of the ebay biscuit barrel remains unclear - and it would seem safe to say that, based on the available details of the lozenge plus the form of decoration - and using the Board of Trade data at Kew - that at present it's not possible to confirm the quoted date of 1843.  

 

[oldglassman]

Hi,
         Thanks Paul S, this would seem to confirm my thoughts that this eBay listing was more full of speculation than actual fact ,although not something I know a lot about the decoration certainly looked to mechanically etched to me and I believe that the technique used on this item does leave behind raised outlines to the images,but again not entirely sure , maybe some of our U S A  friends might know more as I think the technique was widely used there in the later part of the 19th c  though I think it originated a little earlier in England.

cheers ,
             Peter.

[Sid]

Hello

Very nice biscuit barrel!  It looks like a two step etching.  The outline - deeper bright lines -was created with a machine driving a needle through the resist.  It was exposed to the acid bath to create the outline.  Then the resist was removed inside the outlines and the item exposed to acid again - likely an adulterated or weaker acid to give it that frosted look.  The 1843 date is way too early for this decorative technique.

Sid

[oldglassman]

Hi,
               Thanks for that Sid,its not a technique I am familiar with in any depth but you appear to confirm my suspicions that the item is a later date than given ,its a shame the registration mark is confusing but there we go another one of life's little mysteries.

 cheers ,
        Peter.

[flying free]

Sid, thanks for explaining - are there any raised outlines on the barrel then, or is it an illusion?

Peter - those vases are gorgeous! I love the colours together.
m

[Sid]

M

It is an illusion.

Sid