Topic: Design registrations by Jane Webb & others, acting as executors for Joseph Webb

[agincourt17]

Joseph Webb purchased the Coalbourn Hill Glass Works, Wordsley in 1850 (having previously been in business with his cousin Edward). He died on 1 May 1869, aged 56. Initially, Jane Webb, Joseph's wife, and Joseph Hammond, Jane's brother, took over as executors (because his 2 sons, Henry Fitzroy and Joseph Junior were still minors). Jane, along with various others, continued trading in the business from the Coalbourn Hill Glass works (acting as Joseph Webb’s executors) until 13 September 1887. The site of the Coalbourn Hill Glass Works now lies beneath Stourbridge’s Ruskin Centre.

Joseph Webb (and later Jane Webb and his other executors) were the only glass works in the Stourbridge area producing significant amounts of pressed glass wares in comparison to the other local glass works (who were predominantly producers of traditional hand-blown glass wares). The story of Webb’s business and pressed glass output is poorly documented, and their role and status as glassware manufacturers in the area has, in my opinion, been very undervalued. I hope to be able to rectify that situation eventually.

Between July 1872 and January 188, Jane Webb and various other executors registered 15 designs for glass as follows:

*1 Jane Webb & Joseph Hammond
*2 Jane Webb, Joseph Hammond and Henry Fitzroy Webb
*3 Jane Webb and Henry Fitzroy Webb
 
1872
July 21             (Parcel 6)         RD 263540                  *1     Trough for table decoration
December 19   (Parcel 3)         RD 268883              *1   Flower boat
December 19   (Parcel 3)           RD 268884         *1     Pressed Glass Rim fitted with Silvered Plate Glass Plateau.   
 
1873
April 16            (Parcel  4)        RD 272132                 *1   Oval dish, 4 pad feet
December 10   (Parcel 11)       RD 279179                 *1    Pressed deoptric (dioptric) lamp glass for miners lamps
 
1874
June 15            (Parcel 1)         RD 282961                 *1      Pressed glass flower trough
December 21   (Parcel 4)         RD 288015                 *1      Swan planter (frosted)
 
1878
October 15      (Parcel 4)         RD 327641                  *2     Glass
October 15   (Parcel 4)          RD  327642           *2     Glass

 
1879
June 14            (Parcel 2)         RD 336135                  *2      Spear or Assegai
July 21             (Parcel 2)         RD 337344                  *2      Glass
July 29             (Parcel 7)         RD 337572                  *2      Flower stand
 
1885
January 21                                RD 20860                    *3    Embossed pine decoration for cutting and moulding in glass.
January 21                                RD 20861                    *3    Glass perfume bottle formed as a shell.
January 21                                RD 20862                    *3    Glass Perfume Bottle formed as a form…

(Sorry about the formatting, but it goes haywire when I copy and paste from other documents).

Paul S. has already shown 3 of the design representations on the GMB:

RD 288015 at
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,54638.new.html#new
and RDs 268883 and 268883 at
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,54366.msg308246.html#msg308246

I have shown photos of RD 288015 (the swan planter) at
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,54638.0.html
 
Jenny Thompson has a photo of a frosted RD 272132 (oval dish, 4 pad feet) on page 65 (plate 22), and I am attaching a photo of a similar dish but unfrosted and wheel-engraved with ferns.

Does anyone have any photos of the remaining 13 Jane Webb &c registered designs to show, please?

The summary design descriptions from TNA are cursory at best, and it would be of great value to my researches if I could see the design representations.  So if Paul S. happens by, If wonder if he would care to check his TNA design registration representations, please, for any of the remaining Jane Webb &c registered designs, please, and show them here in due course? 

Fred.

[Paul S.]

Is 13 correct by the way, or might it be only 12?           The last three will require a visit to Kew  - and all will probably be staggered over a week or so.
Hope I get a mention in this magnum opus of yours

[agincourt17]

There are 12 Jane Webb &c registered designs in the GMB Rd lookup requests, Paul.
 
The other 3 are for a Thomas Webb Burmese Ware fairy lamp, Bonzo inkwell (expected to have been registered by Studdy), and an arched / bridge-shaped flower trough by Wood.

You will indeed receive substantal credit for your efforts should the Joseph / Jane Webb &c project ever reach a stage (or stages) worthy of wider dissemination. I intend donating the Joseph Webb pieces that I have to the Broadfield House Glass Museum in the not-too-distant future, and the information that I have accumulated by that stage will accompany the donation.

I am a Black Country lad by birth and upbringing, though now living some distance away, and some of the project information may initially find its way into small articles in the weekly local history publication 'The Black Country Bugle', but I will confer directly with you and keep you up to date regardless. 

Fred.

[Paul S.]

all sounds very interesting, and would just like to comment regarding the Kew images for which we have TNA agreement to reproduce on the GMB.              At present, use of these pictures is limited to the GMB only, and would suggest that should you wish to reproduce these elsewhere (of course, you may not have any intention to ever do so), then out of courtesy and for safety's sake you will need to seek approval from Kew.           They seem very helpful and it's likely they'd probably agree, especially if the purpose was for local history interest - but just thought it worth mentioning.

I've wondered often what I might do with my collection of drinking glasses and various Georgian cut glass etc., and had thoughts similar to yourself in that a museum is possibly a worthwhile and likely destination for them.                 

[agincourt17]

Thank you for your advice regarding the Kew images, Paul.

I think the major problem tempering my altruism about donating glass to Museums etc. is that so many donations simply languish in store (often uncatalogued) without ever benefitting from public display (or even research scrutiny). The main reason that my donated Joseph Webb glass will end up in Broadfield House is that their main remit is to concentrate as much as possible on glassware from the locality (so it might have a fighting chance of being catalogued or displayed) . In addition, I know that they are slowly trying to increase the scope of their collection of pressed glass (which tends currently to be mainly the more spectacular decorative pieces, especially those from the north-east of England).

[Paul S.]

here are some of the Jane Webb items, and would ask please that the Look Up requests are adjusted accordingly so that I don't repeat any searches for the same No.

Four more to follow.

[Paul S.]

Two more Nos. (four pix)...............trust all look o.k. - let me know if there are any errors.

[agincourt17]

Fantastic response yet again, Paul – sterling (pun?) work!

In my opening post of a separate topic about a Jane Webb &c pressed glass swan RD 288015 of 21 December 1874 –Parcel 4 at
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,54638.0.html
I mentioned that:

A downturn in trade brought an end to the company in 1886. The works and adjoining house were put up for sale in January 1886 but failed to attract a single bid.  THE MOULDS THAT JOSEPH WEBB AND HIS SUCCESSORS HAD USED TO PRODUCE PRESSED GLASS WERE SOLD TO EDWARD MOORE. Henry Fitzroy Webb became a commercial traveller in the glass trade. Unable to sell the works, Jane Webb leased it to Thomas Mitchell from 14 September 1887 for 14 years. Jane Webb died on 25 May 1899.

I then pointed out that the Edward Moore designs published in the Pottery Gazette for 1 December 1888 showed a pressed glass swan in two sizes (#959 and #960) bearing a remarkable resemblance to the Jane Webb &c swan.

Now I can confirm that the Webb RD 263540 of 21 July 1872 (the triangular flower trough with ridges sides and sitting on small stub feet) seems to be ‘imitated’ in Moore’s two triangular flower troughs (#985 – difficult to read so could be #955 or even 965 - and 971), though the Moore triangular troughs seem to have curved rather than straight sides. Also, the GMB topic at http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,54633.0.html
already draws a comparison (and floats the idea of a possible link) between some of the Moore designs (the triangular, rectangular, bridge / arched troughs, and the swan) and the designs in the 1907 Meisental catalogue at http://www.glas-musterbuch.de/Meisenthal-1907.124+B6YmFja1BJRD0xMjQmcHJvZHVjdElEPTU1NjgmcGlkX3Byb2R1Y3Q9MTI0JmRldGFpbD0_.0.html

Furthermore, Jane Webb &c’s RD 282961 of 15 June 1874 (the curved pressed glass flower trough standing upright rather like a pair of horns) appears to be a dead ringer for Moore’s #979.

So there is already very strong evidence to substantiate the re-use of at least some of the Webb moulds (both those registered by Joseph Webb himself and those registered by Jane Webb &c) by Edward Moore.

I eagerly await the next set of design representations to see if they show any more links between the Jane Webb &c designs and those of Edward Moore.

In the meantime, does anyone have any photos of actual pieces from RDs 253540, 282961, and 337572 to show, please?

I have asked the moderators to delete the lookup requests that have been successfully completed

Fred.

[Paul S.]

Kew pictures for a further eight Rd. Nos. ..............  279179 - 327641/42 - 336135 - 337344 - 20860/61/62........

[Paul S.]

and the rest..........