Topic: Any bottle collectors?

[The Glass Staircase]

Hi all,

I found this bottle a couple of weeks back and I've yet to identify what kind of drink / liquid it was used for if anyone knows? It looks like a beer /alcoholic drink bottle to me  but I may be wrong. It has a registration mark to bottom ( Rd. No. 292875 ) which dates registration to late 1890's if my memory serves me right.

It has an applied / tooled finish and stands 8.75 inches high / 4 inches diameter (at widest point)

[Anne]

Gosh, how did you make out that Rd Design Number? I looked and thought ouch! no chance...  so well done for deciphering it. 

According to Jenny Thompson's book The Identification of English Pressed Glass, the RD No. 292875 was registered on 28 January 1897 by Gustav Doring, London, glass bottle manufacturer.

We don't appear to have any information on Gustav Doring on the board, nor is he mentioned on the History of Glass and Glassmaking in London website, so a wee bit of digging is going to be needed to unearth more about him.  I'll add the RD no. to our lookup request topic and see if Paul can pull out the original registration details on his next visit to the National Archives, as that should give us an address in London at least.

[The Glass Staircase]

Thank you so much for all the information Anne! I look forward to finding out more about Gustav Doring and an address would be a good starting point Kind Regards, Adam

[Paul S.]

regret to say I'm unable to help without visiting the National Archives at Kew  -  so possibly ten days or so before we can resolve this one, and will let you know as soon as I have details.
The moment I saw the name, guess what else came to mind..................   that's right............  Gustave Dore, of whom I'm a big fan.

[Anne]

Paul, that was what kept coming up in searches on Google too... and likewise I'm a fan of Dore's work, so did get slightly sidetracked once or twice! 

[The Glass Staircase]

Waiting ten days or more is fine by me Paul, there is no rush to be honest, thanks in advance

[Paul S.]

here are a couple of pix showing the original drawing - made by whom I'm not sure, but probably by Doring themselves in their capacity as bottle merchants rather than makers of anything      .............   and details from the Board of Trade Register giving details of Doring's address etc. as the Registrant.                                   
As can be seen, this is another of the CLASS IV Registrations.              I couldn't see that the lower case aa referred to anything in particular other than pointing out the ornamentation.

[agincourt17]

May be a related "Doring", but there is  [are?] a glass jar, a glass bottle, and two glass tumblers on the GMB RD database from designs registered by Eric Duncan Doring, Charterhouse Chambers, Charterhouse Square, London E.C.1. in the 1930s.

Here are photos of the four designs for permanent reference :
RD 795417 registered 4 August 1934
RD 797775 registered 6 November 1934
RD 814691 registered 20 August 1936
RD 832566 registered 30 December 1938

I think that some of these design were registered as Class IV too.

Fred.

[Anne]

Just for a bit of background as to the location of Billiter Square, which seems to have been residences in the 1700s that were converted into offices by the mid-late 1890s, rather than a manufacturing type location...  it suffered bomb damage in WW2 and the area was cleared and rebuilt post-war so no trace of its original appearance survives except in archive photos http://collage.cityoflondon.gov.uk/view-item?i=32658 - though there is a map of the area dated c. 1887 http://collage.cityoflondon.gov.uk/view-item?i=31599

So, I went looking for Gustav Doring instead, and found one who in the 1891 Census was staying in a Liverpool hotel where he was recorded as a Merchant, and another who states he was a Glass Agent in the 1901 Census in London. They could well be the same man, despite the stated 3 year difference in ages...  the 1901 Census gives him with Paul Doring (who may be related but is not listed as a brother on the Oldenburg emigrant database) and family, and all of them are visitors in the house of another German woman, Annie Syvarth.

Gustav Doring married Bertha Duncan in Birkdale, Lancashire later in 1891, and one of their sons was Eric Duncan Doring, who Fred referred to in the previous reply. According to the Old Bailey records Gustav Doring (occupation: agent) was summonsed in 1900 for "concealing funds during bankruptcy" but was still working as a Glass Agent on his own account in 1901 (see Census entry). His name is shown on the electoral roll for 1912 and 1913 at 66 Denton Road, Twickenham even though he is absent from there in the 1911 Census. He is shown as having died before November 1920 in Zaandam, NH, Netherlands. His widow and children remained in Hammersmith, London until at least 1931 which is when Eric was running the business at Charterhouse Chambers. Bertha died in 1940 and her probate entry states "DORING Bertha Gertrude of The Sally Lun Rottingdean Sussex widow died 21 January 1940 Probate 1 June to Eric Duncan Doring glass bottle merchant Gertrude Ellen Marguerite Doring spinster and Charnley Duncan Doring glass bottle merchant. Effects £1462 10s 3d."   Eric, Gertrude and Charnley were her three children. 

That they are all referred to as merchants or agents leads me to suppose they did not have their own manufacturing capability but simply bought stock in from various glassworks, to sell on.  Thus the registered designs in their names would be either designs they had commissioned or may be a way to protect an imported range from being copied and sold by other glass merchants.

[The Glass Staircase]

Sorry for the late reply I never realised the thread had been updated. I just want to say thank you to all, especially Paul and Anne, for the information, it is greatly appreciated!

Adam