Topic: HELP IDENTIFYING (MAYBE VICTORIAN) DRINKING VESSEL?

[cjones]

Hi this unusual glass is just 5" in height and has a rough area underneath. Not sure maybe a Vistorian liquor glass perhaps ? The bowl has diagonal ribs , this sits on a circular base which sits on another base decorated with prunts.
Any help greatfully received Thanks Carol

[Paul S.]

Hello Carol  -  sorry, difficult item to attribute or date, and I certainly can't offer anything worthwhile.    Wasn't sure whether you really meant 'liqueur' (as in Cointreau) or simply liquor (as in booze)     Historically, 'liqueur' was certainly drunk from tallish, small bowled glasses, although your bowl may be a tad big for 'liqueur', possibly.        The design of your glass is, as your probably know, copying the shape and decoration of Venetian (style) drinking glasses made in the C16 and C17 - possibly even Spanish.       Your 'diagonal ribs' are a style referred to as 'wrythen', usually, and this again is a historical twist so to speak.     The rough area underneath may be the sharp remains of where the pontil rod was broken away from the piece, and I suspect your particular glass may have been made up from several separate parts.   I can't see too clearly, but the decoration doesn't look like prunts - which are usually roughly circular blobs, and possibly yours is simply applied trailing.       None of which helps you, unfortunately.    Can't see any wear to speak of, but difficult to assess when pieces sit on the out part of the foot only.      Are there any nibbles/wear on the bowl rim???      If this were genuine C19, I'd be looking for dirt lodged in crevices of the design, and some reasonable wear on the foot - the odd seed or air bubbles possibly, but as an uneducated guess, I'd go for Continental (European), in view of the colour.     But then again, this may have been made only 20 years ago as a tourist souvenir  

[cjones]

Thanks Paul for taking the time to respond. There are no real nibbles to speak of although it was extremely dusty before I cleaned it up !!! It's an unusual one. Agree about the broken off pontil I think too the base was hand blown seperate to the other pieces being attached. There are some air bubbles particularly in the foot. It's not a piece of great quality and the glass is quite thick but I do like a mystery !!! Thanks again Carol

[chopin-liszt]

I think that sort of wavy trailing is called rigaree.

Is the foot hollow? I can't quite make it out, but it looks as if it might be.

(I noted your particular interest in the boozy side of the query, Paul   )

[Paul S.]

hello Sue  -  according to Harold Newman  -  'An Illustrated Dictionary of Glass'  -  rigaree is 'a decoration of trailing having the threads of glass impressed by a wheel making a pattern of parallel notches'  -  which was not how I was seeing this example.    However, as always I stand to be corrected by my peers, and your experience is doubtless more extensive than mine     I am trying to drink a little less these days, and oddly I think it is working, as I normally have emormous problems with self-discipline

[cjones]

Paul you know me so well !! Yes foot is hollow. Thanks Carol

[chopin-liszt]

hmmm, perhaps the wavy lines do need to be frilly as well, to be proper rigaree, (this isn't my period, I'm a fish out of water there and no books on it either Paul!)

Ivo says it's an "applied decoration of a crimped or pinched glass ribbon", in "Glass Fact File a-z".

It's definitely a ribbon, but it's not crimped. Is wavyness "pinched"?

  Sometimes I do find myself wondering if sobriety just makes life seem longer..... 

[Paul S.]

well, I have too many books, and frankly my dear it is often more confusing than having too few (at the last count I had about eighty).    I also have Ivo's very useful book, although it wouldn't occur to me to use it for this sort of definition, normally.     It's so easy to quote someone else, but we can't all be geniuses, and I see no harm provided you acknowledge your source.       Would agree that sobriety can make things seem a little boring at times  -  it's the wanting something that you can't have that can make life seem a little tedious - you have my sympathy and I suggest you take more interest in older glass -  if you discover a new area of collecting, maybe it will make the time pass
quicker for you             I will maintain that Carol's decoration is applied wavy trailing.
But this is not really helping Carol, so....................   

[chopin-liszt]

I have no problem finding new "areas" to collect and be interested in - I simply no longer have the means or the space to do so..... but my passion seems to be for contemporary art which is pushing boundaries. I'm the same with classical music - I think contemporary art is just about the most exciting period ever.
 :smg:
(I do not, of course, include the whole media phenomenon of "Brit Art". Some of them are grand - others are no more than media phenomena.)

[Ivo]

I'd call the style 'rustic' rather than historic and given the colour i would be looking at Spain or at Italy. In any case, it must have been a glass works with top glass blowers but limited ambition - perhaps Gordiola or Altare?