Topic: Butter dish, cover and stand c.1800-1820?

[cagney]

  My bad. I did not mean to imply that the two wines were the same age as the butter. Just that I did better on price, as I probably paid retail for the butter.
The 4 1/2 in. wine/claret with notch stem is about c.1900 and uses similar decorative elements of an earlier period. The notched stem and the thinner foot is the giveaway as to approximate date. The notched stem used often in the late brilliant period, much easier to do than the hollow cut and shaped stems of the early brilliant period. Likely American.
  The other wine/claret? At almost 5 1/2 in. a simple motif made widely in the second quarter of the nineteenth century. The only reason I bought it is because it is out of the norm, having the collar below the bowl cut inline with the bowl. It is the only one like that I have come across. I call it a skirted collar. I tend toward the esoteric sometimes.

  Because we always like photos of glass on this board. The first three show a blown and cut 4 in. wine glass c. about 1830. Pretty sure English. The tumbler is the American version c. 1830. The English version does  the extra cut to make the puntys/circles stand proud on the glass. The American version the puntys/circles  do not stand proud , but I think still achieve the same decorative effect.

[flying free]

They are wonderful.  Do they have a nice heft?  I love drinking from either a heavy glass (water etc) or a very fine thin one cut at the rim, no lip (wine), so particularly love that tumbler.  Also the geometric pattern reminds me of St Louis/Baccarat c.1840 in the Launay Hautin catalogues.  A geometric pattern seems strangely timeless if it doesn't have an extraneous frilly/detailed cutting.  That tumbler would sit nicely in a bar right now

Oddly that notched stem on the second glass you posted always makes me think VSL as they seem to use that device quite often.

m

[cagney]

  The pattern and its variants show up now and again in various glass techniques besides early American cut glass and English cut. Similar designs roughly dating c.1825-1850  in  so-called American blown three mold, French pressure molded and EAPG c.1850s https://www.eapgs.net/pattern-details.php?idx=1847 In early American cut glass the pattern is a nice break from the ubiquitous strawberry diamond and fan. Good heft to the tumblers as usually the bases are thick. Stemware so-so. Not as hefty as the French pressure molded ware as they are usually a bit thicker and a higher lead content.

More pics:

[thewingedsphinx]

Similar rim ?
https://www.the-saleroom.com/en-gb/auction-catalogues/fieldings-auctioneers-ltd/catalogue-id-srfi10168/lot-1a7b3f50-aa90-484f-bd09-b03c00bc0176

[flying free]

In Charles Hajdamach's British Glass 1800-1914 page 42 there are a few items from the Wear Flint Glass Company. They are from the Londonderry table service.  The bowl has a similar cut rim to your butter.  I think.  It's quite difficult to tell from the black and white pic as it's not big.

There is also a little deep bowl with one raised glass 'handle' - think they are called 'piggins' but not sure. That handle looks to have a similar rim cut to your bowl. 
They are marked pieces engraved with the Londonderry coat of arms.

Some pictures here:
https://www.artfund.org/supporting-museums/art-weve-helped-buy/artwork/2094/the-londonderry-glass-table-service

I couldn't see anything in the book of that early glass with that draped cut design on your butter.


m

[cagney]

  Certainly, the outline of the cut rim and van dyke would be correct. Old school term still much in use. Crenelated [ relating to battlements ] more descriptive to me [ I did have to look it up ]. The extra cuts within the shaped rim are a nice touch on the bowl in the link provided by THEWINGEDSPINX. Mine just has drape cuts that join together under every high point. The link was informative in the sense that I looked for wear under the rim to see if it was hung in the metal holder like the bowl in the link. Upon inspection there is no wear and also noticed that under the rim is panel cut to match the cuts below, wow.

  [m] thanks for the link, always interested in documented pieces. What interested me most was the stoppers on the decanters. The hollow blown/cut stopper predominates in American cut glass of this period, although usually less refined. My new obsession is trying to delineate the difference between American and English cut glass in this period, roughly 1820- 1840. I noticed  the bowls pictured in your link and one seems to have a more flare to the rim, different blowers on the blanks? After all the cutter can only cut the blank he has.

[flying free]

They could both be finger bowls.  Or could it be possible the one with the distinct everted rim may have had some kind of lid?


Decanter hollow stopper - this one is apparently attributed to the Wear Flint Glass company and has an original hollow stopper.  Lovely cutting on this example - beautiful design of the pattern.

https://www.exhibitantiques.com/item/1879/exhibitantiques/Rare-Georgian-Wear-Flint-Company-Cut-Glass-Decanter-c1825.html


More examples here from the Lambdon service(this is a good site for looking at lovely glass   )
https://filemanantiques.co.uk/decanters/sets-of-decanters-1/a-elaborate-suite-of-regency-period-cut-glass-from-the-lambton-service

m

[flying free]

http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,72775.msg404707.html#msg404707

...

  Because we always like photos of glass on this board. The first three show a blown and cut 4 in. wine glass c. about 1830. Pretty sure English. The tumbler is the American version c. 1830. The English version does  the extra cut to make the puntys/circles stand proud on the glass. The American version the puntys/circles  do not stand proud , but I think still achieve the same decorative effect.

Similar design on these decanters?  It says '1820 England' on the listing:
https://filemanantiques.co.uk/decanters-1/pairs-1-of-decanters-1-1/an-exceptional-pair-of-swirl-cut-regency-9-decanters-1-with-swirl-cut-stoppers

[cagney]

  The links provided very much appreciated, as they are exactly what I am looking for. The "comet" decanters in your last link perfectly illustrate in the close up of the pattern the extra cut coming off the dividing cut between the "comets" to encircle the punties and allow them to stand proud. The type of shaped base on these decanters just does not occur on any American examples I am aware of in the so-called globular form. The American examples always a solid applied foot,  may or may not be cut underneath. Although the basic Prussian form predominates the globular much favored by collectors and well documented in American cut glass in this period.

  Fortunately I have access to a collection of early cut glass assembled over the last 40+ years, some of the pieces I personally sold to him. More photos of typical examples, pretty sure American. The type of stopper in the last photo is the one most commonly encountered, considered a generic stand in unless the customer paid extra for one to match the pattern on the decanter. If surviving examples are any indication most customers did not.