Topic: Peloton vases with 27 moulded ribs.

[heartofglass]

I know that there are some counters of ribs on moulded glass items out there-you know who you are!
Well, I am interested in your opinions on these two Victorian peloton glass vases.
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-9744
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-9743
Both have 27 ribs, with a corresponding 27 half-round bosses around the widest point of the vase's middle.
The clear vase with multi-coloured threads & silver plate stand was purchased in the U.K in 2003, & the white vase with blue threads was purchased recently on Ebay, also from a seller in the U.K.
The clear vase also features a subtle ring of opalescence around its neck. The base of the vase does not have a pontil mark, it has a pegged base which has been fixed into the silver plate stand with plaster of paris.
The white vase has a pink spatter interior which extends to the base, & has a slight pontil mark, not quite rough & not ground out either.
Both have top rims with a similar double crimped treatment, despite the other differences.
The reason that I would like opinions on this particular 27-ribbed mould is that I have heard conjecture about English peloton glass, & I feel that these two vases may be examples of such.
Thus my interest in the number of ribs on this rather distinctive mould shape!
It is of course well known that peloton glass was originally patented by Wilhelm Kralik in 1880, whilst he was in the employ of the Harrach glassworks. However, I have read numerous assertions that peloton glass was also manufactured in Stourbridge. As I have a fairly substantial (40 items) collection of peloton glass, I have noticed many variations in terms of colours, shapes, mould types, etc. Obviously they are from a number of different manufacturers. Sadly, there is little information available about this obscure type of Victorian glass. I would like to find out more about the other manufacturers of peloton glass.
Looking forward to your thoughts on these.

[Leni]

Definitely 'sisters', Marinka!   :clap:  But I don't recall ever seeing anything exactly like them, with the ribs AND bosses, in my searches for Victorian glass!  :huh:  Any marks or other clues on the metal base?   

[heartofglass]

Hi Leni,
sadly there are no marks at all on the silver plate base! And nothing on the vases. My only hope of an i.d is via that distinctive mould design.

[Bernard C]

Marinka — Thanks for the email reminder — I had intended to reply, but it slipped from my mind.   And I am no "expert" on pattern repeats, it's just that it seems obvious to me to record the few characteristics of an item that can never change, whatever further operations the glassmaker carries out.

27 is very unusual indeed for a moulded pattern repeat in my experience.   Almost all of the moulded pattern repeats I have seen are factors of 720, the number of ½°s in a complete circle (2 x 360).   I believe that this just reflects the fact that mouldmaking is a type of engineering, and engineers think, and their tools are calibrated, in degrees.   So moulded pattern repeats of 7, 11, 13, 17, 19, 21, 22, 23, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, and 31 are all extremely rare.   Previously I have knowingly seen just the one exception, a pattern repeat of 32, on a ribbed bowl by Walsh.

Note that I am not talking about cut patterns, where the blank is marked up by hand.   Here a pattern repeat of 7 is occasionally met, particularly on patterns involving windows through which can be seen the pattern on the opposite side of the vase or bowl, and the designer didn't want the patterns to line up.

So your vases are of interest just for that.

I don't know whether counting moulded pattern repeats will yield any useful information.   So far it hasn't, but if everyone always did it, it might.

Bernard C. 

[heartofglass]

Many thanks for your input Bernard.
(Sorry I haven't replied sooner but I have been out celebrating my birthday)
Fascinating point about the number of ribs! I did think it was an unusual mould, & it seems my uneducated guess was right in a way.

[Catisfaction]

Hi Marinka,
Long time no speak, I hope you are still well and you don't mind too much that I'm posting on a long ago thread.
I have a Peloton vase that I believe could be related to the piece on the right in your photos. Just thought I'd drop off a pic.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v285/catisfaction/AfterEngland138.jpg?t=1280411761

[heartofglass]

Hi Helen! Yes it has been a while, & many thanks for your post.
The vase or jug that you have is really beautiful! And it definitely looks like a very close relative of my mysterious 27 - rib peloton pieces.
I still haven't found out any more information about the origin of these vases, though....