Topic: Double overlay Pepper/sugar pot, hallmarked 1848 , Birmingham

[Andy]

Ive done a bit of research on the Hallmark, I think its Birmingham, 1848,(date letter Z) Silversmith, HM,
Henry Manton.
Its a very pretty and quality pot, (pepper probably)
3 layers, top is a pale blue, white in the middle, and cut to clear .
Must be a Stourbridge maker,
Any ideas, views, info welcome.
Thanks
Andy

[Andy]

Im leaning towards Richardson

The colours unusual, any clues there?

[Bernard C]

Andy — The only reference I can find to such glass is in Hajdamach.   Colour plate 5 p.86 illustrates a similar vase.   His comments include "an area where the attribution to Bohemia, England or France can be extremely arbitrary" and, considering this specific vase, "may be Saint Louis", although he provides no evidence for this suggestion.

His message comes across as if you can't match to a published design or one in the original pattern books, then you've got a severe attribution problem.   You can't eliminate English glassworks, as by 1848 Richardson, Rice Harris, and Bacchus all seem to have been manufacturing such glass.

Bernard C. 

[Frank]

Here are a couple of perfume sprays from a little known German/Bohemian glassworks Brüder Rachmann 1857-c1945. Similarities being colour (allowing for print interpretation) and use of cut punties and lines. These were amongst the most expensive of the range of 600+ items in the catalogue I have.

They also produced tableware. Assumption is that they were decorators - but after several years of research, I suspect they were also making the glassware. The had a large factory in Haida and one brother was a glassmaker and the other a metal worker. I am still waiting on a contact with a descendant who has photographs of the factory and possibly some of their other catalogues.

Images courtesy The Glass-Study (Glass Catalogue)

[Andy]

Thanks Chaps
Bernard, it was that picture i was looking at, another look and the pattern is very similar
to the glass , far right, possibly Bacchus.
Frank, those little bottles are also very similar!
Ive just rechecked the hallmark site, the seller of the pot had said it was 1899 , reading up,
the duty mark, the Queens head, stopped in 1890, mine has , i think a faint queens head, and
this type of glass seems to have been fashionable at mid 19thC so i think im right in 1848.
That would discount Bruder Rachmann! Maybe they were taking inspiration, from the makers of
my little pot Shame i havent got the whole set!
Probably as close as im going to get with this one, i'll put my bet on Birmingham area
(actually if the date letter Z is next up, 1874, then it could be Franks suggestion )

Thanks again,
Andy

[krsilber]

I'm confused.  On the Glass Catalogue site it says,

"Brüder Rachmann - Glas- und Metallwaren-Fabrik ♦ Rachmann Brothers - Glass and Metal Works ♦ Rachmann Frères - Cristallerie et fabricants de métal

Founded 1874 - closed 1945(?)."

I think you're right, Frank, that it was a glass manufacturer, and not just a decorator.  The decorating companies seem to call themselves Glasrafinerie (glass refiners).  The fact that they were a metalworking company as well would argue against a scenario where glass was imported to England and the silver top was added there.

Andy, the interesting color of your piece reminds me of a tumbler I have.  It's color to me seems wrong for Bohemian, and I wondered if it was Boston and Sandwich, but maybe it's English or French.  At least you have some markings on yours!

[Frank]

It was fairly normal to add the silver tops in the UK for Bohemian glass, they would also use English registered design numbers organised by the UK factors. From the complete lack of Rachmann marked glass it is possible that they operated exclusively through factors. That makes it near impossible to prove they actually made the glass, combined with fact that much Bohemian glass used different makers and decorators.

[Sue C]

Andy, the shape of the sheild also tell's you what year the silver was assayed along with thw marks, could we see a clearer pic of the mark please?

Also is the neck of the bottle longer than the pepper cap?

[krsilber]

This is from Neuwirth's Das Glas des Jugendstils, talking about Fachschule Haida:  "Rohglas fuer [ach, umlauts aren't working] die Werkstaetten der Fachschule lieferten kostenlos die Haidaer Firmen J. Gerner, S. Reich and Co., Brueder Rachmann, Carl Hosch..."  Doesn't that mean BR et al. provided blanks for the school?  I think they were a glassmaker, not just a decorating company.  It says elsewhere in the book that BR were pretty good at cutting cased glass, or something to that effect.

[Frank]

Sounds like it! One more incidental confirmation.