Topic: Karl Wiedmann, Gralglas -- or rather not?

[rocco]

These vases are attributed to Karl Wiedmann for Gralglas everywhere, but as with >> those other vases I wonder if they might be Polish as well.
Height 32 cm, the base has a ground and polished, but far from circular pontil mark...

Several more of them:
Link 1
Link 2
Link 3

Not found in the Gralglas book or on the CD-Rom, neither is the shape found in any of their catalogues. If they were Unikat pieces, I guess there should have turned up one with a signature, but I haven't come across that yet.

On the other hand they seem to be relatives of the >> ball candleholders which have been attributed to Wiedmann/Gralglas with some certainty

Any thoughts highly appreciated!

Michael

[flying free]

I can't answer your question but have one of my own 
What do you mean they seem to be relatives of the ball glass candleholders?  I honestly can't see the connection between the vase you show and the candleholders, other than that they both use silver chlorides?

On the Glaskilian site in one of the links there is something 'similarish' to the vase in shape here (2nd row down far right), but that is the only one I could see and I don't think it is  the same shape 
http://www.glaskilian.de/ib/ib57.htm
m

[rocco]

m, thank you for your contribution!

I certainly may be wrong, but I think there are some -- more than accidental -- similarities between the vases and the candleholders; if you scroll down to the blue one and the pic of the 3 different coloured ones, the blue and the orange remind of the colours in my vase and in the orange vase in my second link, so do the small silver chloride dots in all pieces.

Here is >> a lovely ashtray Anik posted, which seems related both to the candleholders and the vases.

I also checked the Wiedmann exhibition catalogue, and there is one Ikora glass vase from 1928 similar to the metal vase you linked to (and vaguely similar to my vase, just much more flared top), PN 111/3496. The decor is far more complex, and the height is only 23,6 cm.

Michael

[flying free]

oh ok I see   sorry Michael, I didn't scroll down the link and had forgotten about the blue ashtray.  I can see I commented on that thread  but I'd forgotten about it.
Dirk had a conversation here http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,46485.msg264702.html#msg264702
on that thread that confirmed them as Wiedmann
The reason I had asked about it was because they reminded me of a decor on a piece I had that was by Cari Zalloni for WMF iirc.  I will try and find a picture of it if I still have one.  It was a bright blue candleholder with just the silver chlorides, nowhere near as pretty as these pieces and no other nice special effects like your vase or the ball candles or the ashtray though.  It was just the blue and chlorides that reminded me of it I think.  And probably not linked to these pieces at all which is perhaps why I didn't mention it on that thread.
I'll add a pic once I find one.
I didn't spot the vase but I guess a similar shape to the metal one...mmm, it's slightly different to yours isn't it? the flared rim is different.
m

[rocco]

Thanks, m.
Yes, those blue-with-Silver-Chloride 1970s WMF pieces are quite abundant on German ebay, not exclusively in Zalloni shapes.
Seems the only colourway they are found in, so I would think rather not related to the pieces in question.

BTW, I had forgotten about the ashtray thread as well (and that I had contributed to it).
Dirk mentions >> there the vases as well.

It would be much better (regarding value) if my vase and the other items from this range were Gralglas and Wiedmann.
If they turned out to be Polish, I guess they wouldn't sell in that price range anymore, though they are still lovely pieces.

So let us hope we will find a labelled one some day which will tell one way or the other...

Michael

[flying free]

As I read it,
Reading through Dirk's post it says that Gunther Hoffman confimed Anik's candleholders as by Wiedmann
There are 4 candleholders from Anik if I read it correctly -  3 multicoloured and 1 only blue with chlorides.
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,38212.msg236192.html#msg236192

In the Gunther Hoffman conversation I wonder which ones he was shown and confirmed as by Wiedmann?  I ask because in this post (see link) last photo, the astray looks very similar to the left hand candleholder but not as much to the right hand one.  Also the right hand one looks bigger and as if it has more clear glass casing on it.  It might just be the way it was made, the way the chlorides have played out in the glass, and these might be small differences in the same range anyway.  But there appears to be some small differences.  I was wondering if they were a 'later issue' or something perhaps? or maybe a reissue by another company?
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,46485.msg261106.html#msg261106

Your vase doesn't look to have the chlorides and colours laid on in the same way as the three multicoloured ball candleholders, but that might just be the way I am seeing it?

Hoffman said there was a vase as well, but it's impossible from that to deduce what kind of vase really I think.  Perhaps it has been assumed that meant the vases like yours?

m

[flying free]

I have made some amendments to my post directly above this one having read another thread on the board.
m

[Ivo]

On the Glaskilian site in one of the links there is something 'similarish' to the vase in shape here (2nd row down far right), but that is the only one I could see and I don't think it is  the same shape 
http://www.glaskilian.de/ib/ib57.htm
m

On the risk of being offtopic and superfluous  I think I should mention that these items are all Ikora metal - there is no glass involved.

[flying free]

Not superfluous and I should have made that clear Ivo.  Thank you   It was just the shape I was referring to.
m

[rocco]

I cannot really add much more, I would think the difference in the distribution of the colours and chlorides hail from the different ways a tall vase and a small (massive) candleholders are produced?
IMHO, the greyish-yellow silver chlorides and the orange stuff (whatever it is) seem to be similar in all pieces.

I am sure we will find out one day. (Hopefully I am just over suspicious)

edit: I was always convinced that these are the vases mentioned in the thread belonging to the same range as the candle holders, but I may be wrong...

Michael