Topic: ChanceGlass.net : cataloguing Fiestaware patterns

[Max]

I thought this might be of interest.  As far as I can tell, it could be a precursor to the lace pattern.  Very fine glass, transfered to base and upper side.

Let's see if I can get the Yobunny gallery to work!

http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-1102

Erm...I think that link takes you to my album.  There's other pics of that lace plate, and also a cobweb sugar bowl + lid, and a large Waverley pressed glass bowl.

Hmm...your gallery seems to save time Anne!   :wink:

[David E]

Max: The sugar bowl is certainly unusual and I'd like to include that on the site – variety is the spice of life, so they say. I'll also repost the photo onto the Pressed Glass topic as well. I have got a photo of a large Waverley bowl (that was sent to me free of charge from the USA!), but if you have the dimensions that would be appreciated (likewise the sugar bowl).

The Lace patterned dish I can't be sure about. Anne posted an image of a bowl sometime ago that I originally thought was an early Fiesta pattern but it turned out to be made by a (West) German company called Union Glass under their 'Filigran' tradename and was probably dated c.1970. However, again the size might help confirm this one way or the other at some stage.

It does look quite similar in shape to the 'Rounded 3-sided Nut   Dish' on the 'Shapes' page and the sizes I have for these are (in inches): 5, 6¼, 8 across (12.5, 16 or 20 cm).

On the Curiosity Scale it's currently "quite interesting", but I'll let you know when it gets to "pant wetting" :lol:

[Max]

David

The little sugar bowl is 12cm across the widest point.  It's too hard to measure the height...it's all curves!  However, I've got a little vase in Spiderweb too and the base of the sugar bowl is exactly like that...sort of has a little dimple in the middle.

I feel there's a good possibility that the lace dish is Chance.  I'd put it earlier than 1970's, it feels more like late 50's, but I'm only guessing.  Were they making this stuff then?  It's much better quality than later Chance stuff anyway.  The glass is very fine, the transfer is subtle, and the gold rim is thick and overlaps into the bowl and over the side by 3mm.

It measures just under 8" at its widest point.  Hmm....velly interesting!


PS:  The Waverley bowl is just under 9.5" across and just over 3" high.  What is it with Chance??? Why all the strange measurements??!!  I got it for £1 in a charity shop yesterday, and the Spiderweb sugar bowl for £1.95 - bargain!

[David E]

Thanks for the dimensions, I'll include this in the data.

I recently bought a 'Chance Swirl' dish with a Spirograph style pattern (you also noted this) and this also has an overlapping gold trim. I wasn't convinced it was Chance, but have since been told it is. To be posted soon.

The dimension appears to be correct so a great find if it is Chance! But while most of their dimensions were imperial, virtually all Fiestaware is a fraction out (often ¼" or more), which can probably be attributed to the plain glass blanks being the exact size, not the finished shape (which 'slumped' when heated).

[David E]

Here is the 'Spirograph' dish:



Quite similar (but not the same) to the pattern I believe may be called 'Green Leaves':

[David555]

Hi

Fantastic site David - I can't believe it has grown in such a quick time with so much information, surely it is the best Pilkington/Chance site on the internet already - such fantastic and easy to access pages on colours, shapes, and older Pilkington items. Already seems so complete, but I know you are still ‘a work in progress’ in a way a research site always is.

Fantastic you have had so many contributors from GMB. I believe this has been a viable project because the glass is abundant in the UK and is not expensive (although prices are rising).

I guess you have already covered this, but here goes – packaging.

I think it was an important angle when ‘Fiestaware’ was launched – I think it was clever to have a simple shallow box with a gold grid pattern and a plastic top kept tight by a ‘gold’ elastic band – this looked glitzy and allowed the buyer to view the wares. I also think having a plain inner box base for interchangeable couler card backgrounds was cool – dark patterns could be white lighter patterns could be red or blue or black – I don’t know how many card backgrounds were used.

I can only really talk about flat ware as I don’t know how handkerchief vases were packaged – any info?

Here is a ‘Clematis’ pattern small oblong tray in its box – white background/label type 1




Here is a ‘Daisy’ pattern small oblong tray in its box – red background/label type 2



Back of box where stock codes were often written



Here is a kidney shaped 'Lace' pattern tray - the base card is a deep metallic blue, note the simpler way of securing this larger items lid.



I know of label changes, what about box pattern changes and different ways of securing lid must be a few out there?

I have to end with my favourite shape – the ‘spear head’ – it is just so like my favourite Poole Pottery ‘spear head’ shape, I wonder whose shape came earlier?



All these items cost £1.50 at a recent car boot sale - imagine original packaging and all for that price!

Adam P

[David E]

Hi, and thanks for the compliments. I also have to admit I'm also staggered by the response, and also the length of this thread... will it ever end???

But there is no way I could have got so far in such a short time without the help of those contributors who have found new patterns, made suggestions, named the flamin' floral patterns for me and provided such wonderful photos — to be honest it's really the GMB's web pages, not mine! :oops:

To all these people, a sincere and heartfelt THANK YOU!

You are right about the packaging: it has been covered within the site and there are three patterns that should help identify ages. I think this is in date order:

1. Diamond shaped (to 1971?)
2. Star shapes (possibly before the Diamond shape?)
3. Cross-line grid pattern (the last box style?)

But there might be earlier box styles yet to be found. The number written on the back (100) probably indicates the shape code. According to my documentation, this should be a 10" plate with plain rim? Once I have all these numbers I will compile [yet another] cross-reference.

However, your Daisy & Clematis pattern dishes are of particular interest because of the labels, which dates it exactly the same as my original guess. Daisy was introduced in 1970 or later and that's the end-date I'd given this particular label.

The Clematis pattern reveals the same 'Diamond' box style was still being used at 1971 or later, but the new logo on the label is pretty solid evidence of when this style of label was first used and when the old 'script' logo was finally dropped (now being used again by Chance Ltd).

It is therefore reasonable to assume the changes to the logo came about in 1970 when Pilkington assumed full control over Chance (previously they had a major shareholding).

The last item is referred to as 'Teardrop' – a new naming convention at this stage might lead to confusion! This shape was first used no later than the mid-1960s (Swirl used this and the design was ended around this time) but I don't have a firm date. We have yet to determine the pattern name, but use Max's original 'Trippy Flower' name...

Thanks for sharing these finds: most illuminating.

[David E]

One point about the GlassyEye.com web site: because the Chance side has grown so quickly, I am thinking of a new dedicated web site (with its own URL) to hold all the information. It is getting rather unwieldy and it's best I do it now, rather than later.

ADDENDUM: I missed the Kidney Dish — this is FILIGREE not Lace :shock:

But the shape is also quite an uncommon one. If you have the sizes for all these items it would be most welcome.

Is it 9¾" x 6" by any 'chance'?

[David555]

Thanks Dave

Your comments are really interesting - "my you do know your stuff" and you have great humility a rare thing - I am starting to go to boot sales again now and will look for Chance - there was a lot at one boot sale, I just couldn't carry anymore (I was buying Czech glass) LOL.

Interesting what you say about the box types and label

The Clematis pattern reveals the same 'Diamond' box style was still being used at 1971 or later

sounds safe suggestion when I think about other companies, Iittala were still using Karhula boxes after the date most sources say they were phased out - I have a catalogue to prove it - inside would be a item with an Iittla label. ‘Waste not want not’ during transitional periods!

'Teardrop' ahh what a lovely name - I can buy these quite cheaply in Glasgow, a glass shelf of them would look amazing!

Thanks filigree, not lace :oops:

You know I forgot they also used a cardboard lid - same time as the plastic one   :idea:

OK I get it (duhhhh) - deeper item - that may mean the handkerchief vases came in a big square box - pattern as below



Will post sizes tomorrow afternoon

[David555]

Daisy 14.5cm x 11.3cm, 2cm high

Clematis 14.4cm x 11.3cm, 2cm high

Teardrop 29.4cm x 17cm at widest area, 5cm high at base end, 3.5cm high at spear end

Filigree Kidney 26.2cm long (sold in May 2004) no more measurements kept in my database

Filigree Oval 16.5cm long, 13.5cm wide, no record of height but I think was near 3.5cm, maybe higher - it was a shallow bowl really
(sold in May 2004)

Both Filigree were photographed with an old camera – that is why they are not so sharp